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Professional help needed: NG Natural Tank Bottle GT-Pak on ebay

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  • Professional help needed: NG Natural Tank Bottle GT-Pak on ebay

    Hello all,

    Somebody is selling CNG bottles that are small and cheap on ebay. They look like they would be perfect for emergencies. Can any of you professionals enlighten us non-professionals onto the likelihood and most importantly the safety issues involved in using such bottles. Just to point out, the last time I got towed to a CNG station, I waited an hour and 15 minutes for the guy to show up.

    The link is here:

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NG-Na...317|240%3A1318

    Please let us all know if this will work out.
    1998 Honda GX
    ebike

  • #2
    Re: Professional help needed: NG Natural Tank Bottle GT-Pak on ebay

    These tanks are not suitable for CNG for vehicles. The Gt-Pak website describes a maximum storage pressure of 275psi. Compressors for CNG vehicles store gas at a pressure of 3000 or 3600psi. Configuring these tanks for automotive use would be incredibly dangerous.
    CDNCNG
    2004 Ram 1500 dual fuel 5.7 Hemi
    2001 Ram 3500 cargo 5.2 Dedicated

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    • #3
      Re: Professional help needed: NG Natural Tank Bottle GT-Pak on ebay

      I don't think it would be dangerous if done right, but it would not be practical. That small bottle at 275psi might not even be enough to restart the engine after running out of CNG. If it were 3000psi it might be enough to go, say, 5 miles. Maybe enough to get you to a station, maybe not depending on where you are.

      One night my wife ran out of CNG after going to 3 nonworking or nonexistant (old guidebook data) stations and the tow truck had to try 3 more stations and got 40 miles away by the time they found a working one (it was a bad night!).
      02 GX
      01 GX
      03 Crown Vic
      06 GX
      Home Fueler

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      • #4
        Re: Professional help needed: NG Natural Tank Bottle GT-Pak on ebay

        Now that the practical points have been convered, unless the tank, if it did meet NGV-2 or FMVSS 304, it would have to be mounted in accordance with NFPA 52. The valve on the tank would have to be changed to be compatable with NGV -1, and no you can't make an adaptor, that is covered in NFPA 52.

        There might be a way to legally carry the tank when pressurized, but that would be a DOT issue and it would be under HAZ MAT jurisdiction.

        At least people are thinking outside the box and are questions about safety and practical application.

        Pass

        Larrycng

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        • #5
          Re: Professional help needed: NG Natural Tank Bottle GT-Pak on ebay

          We're talking here about a portable emergency tank, a legal method of configuring which isn't described in any meaningful (read: practical) way by any of the regulations (is it?).
          02 GX
          01 GX
          03 Crown Vic
          06 GX
          Home Fueler

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          • #6
            Re: Professional help needed: NG Natural Tank Bottle GT-Pak on ebay

            I understand what you are saying about "emergency fuel supply" in small amounts. When you are dealing with compressed gasses at high pressures, the cylinders need to be inspected and checked, just like a small oxygen or acetylene bottle) no matter what the use or purpose. I can't remember the exact area (DOT 178 is all I can remember), but if they are transported on public roads it comes under state and or federal regulations (DOT for the feds and CHP for Calif).

            The regulations also specify how they are to be carried, attached in whatever manner to prevent rolling around during transport. No, the requirements for transport are not as stringent as the mounting of a CNG cyllinder in a vehicle. Look at the way oxygen and high pressure gases, both flamable and non flamable, are transported.

            Are you talking about carrying the emergency fuel supply with you in the vehicle? Are you talking about have the emergency fuel delivered as you would by road service like you would a 5 gal can of gasoline?

            Maybe we both need to do some research as to legality about methods and volumes of gas?

            Later

            Larrycng

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            • #7
              Re: Professional help needed: NG Natural Tank Bottle GT-Pak on ebay

              I am curious about your request, as it seems that your vehicle is not meeting with your expectations as far as range is concerned. Has your vehicle always been falling short on your routine travels, or is it that your route has changed and put you outside the territory of fuel stations? If your driving routine is unchanging and fuel availability has not been a concern, then I would focus my attention on driveability issues which could be affecting your fuel economy. This may include brake or suspension components/alignment as well as engine malfunctions. I would check my tire pressures every time I refuel and buy low rolling resistance tires, when it came time for replacement. If everything is mechanically sound with your vehicle, and you are just dealing with a change in driving habits, then by all means add an extra tank to your vehicle. With all the different tank manufacturers in Southern CA (Quantum, SCI, Luxfer) I would steer clear of buying a tank off of e-bay, because even if the tank is inspected before purchase, it could be damaged in transit. Certain type 4 cylinders may hide transit damage do the materials used in construction. Please make sure that you would not be exceeding the GVWR and GCVWR of your vehicle by adding this tank and also think about the effects of vehicle handling if the cylinder is mounted after the axle. Good Luck

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              • #8
                Re: Professional help needed: NG Natural Tank Bottle GT-Pak on ebay

                I know nothing of the safety stuff,but if you had a legal back up tank,let's say it was a 1.5 gge. You would only get .75 gge transferred why, because with out a compressor the pressure would only equalize the two tanks. Now for tire pressure this is a good thing to do but keep in mind these two thing's. First ONLY check your tires when they are cold meaning not having driven 5 to 10 miles to the station. Then checking them they are now HOT tires the pressure will be higher giving you a false reading.Also if one side of your car is facing the sun all day those tires will have a higher temp also giving a false reading. Best time early morning or late evening when tires are cool or cold. Things you learn when to check the pressure on your semi with 34 tire's. It will also extend the life of your tires.

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                • #9
                  Re: Professional help needed: NG Natural Tank Bottle GT-Pak on ebay

                  Originally posted by rocketmanpete View Post
                  ,let's say it was a 1.5 gge. You would only get .75 gge transferred
                  That's only true if the tanks are the same size. If, say, the tank in the car is 3x the portable tank capacity, when the presssure equalizes you would have 3/4 of the gas in the car's tank and 1/4 left in the portable tank.

                  PS Those boat CNG tanks are probably way less than 1/2 GGE.
                  02 GX
                  01 GX
                  03 Crown Vic
                  06 GX
                  Home Fueler

                  Comment

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