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New reqt Utah (mandatory tank inspection)

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  • eabishop
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah

    Listen to Jared! The job of a fuel system inspector is vital for ensured safety as well as helping CNG conversions maintain a good reputation. Remember to that the inspector covers the entire system, fuel leaks , PRD's, proper cylinder mounting, all for your safety. Be thankful that the inspections arent every year like safety and emissions!

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  • fordtruck76_390
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah (mandatory tank inspection)

    Hey everyone,
    I am new to this forum and just bought my little brother his first car, which is our family's first natural gas car. So with that said I am still learning about CNG and trying to figure this out. I found out about the tank inspection here on this forum so I was kind of upset because everywhere seems to be pretty expensive. A place in Centerville was $100, in Woods Cross $75. Then I talked to the people at CNG Solutions out in Sandy and they were only charging $50. I went out there and they got our car right in for the inspection and not only inpected the tank, but the whole CNG system for leaks or problems. The workers were all friendly and very informative. I was very impressed. I will definitely go back there in the future. If you need to have your tank inspected, you should check them out.

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  • slim
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah (mandatory tank inspection)

    If you read the inspection requirements it says to have the tank visually inspected every 36 months. Then it says as a side note to find a certified inspector for tank certification see this website - It doesnt say anywhere that the person performing the state inspection must be trained or certified in cng tank inspection, it lays out instructions as if showing the average state inspector how to check tanks visually and for certification labels, similar to how they inspect other fuel systems. I take all this as state inspectors are required to verify your tank is labeled and inspected per UHP state inspection procedures, and prices (17.00), I dont see anywhere a need for special tank inspections by 3rd parties unless your tank is missing the label.
    This is the info state inspectors were given regarding this : publicsafety.utah.gov/safetyinspections/docs/02-09_February_Newsletter.pdf

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  • eystermd
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah (mandatory tank inspection)

    Has anyone taken the time to look up the referenced code for this requirement? It is 49 CFR 571.304. It's interesting reading and seems to me that the requirement is being blown way out of proportion. Anyone have some intelligent thoughts on this?

    Mike

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  • Highmarker
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah (mandatory tank inspection)

    Todd,

    The tank inspections I perform take me about an hour to do. I don't see how someone can do one in 10 minutes. Also, the sticker MUST be placed on the tank. It also seems that the Davis Tech Center has got to get their act together.
    Last edited by Highmarker; 07-15-2010, 09:25 PM. Reason: Editted last sentence

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  • jeepzz
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah (mandatory tank inspection)

    When I got my tank certification inspection on my factory bi-fuel GMC Sierra (last year), I was in and out in 10 minutes. I'm sure 99% of that time was spent on removal of the factory tank cover. How thorough of an inspection can be done in just a few minutes? I'll not going to list the name of the shop to protect the innocent/guilty.
    They asked where I wanted the 'approved' sticker placed and recommended that it be put on the tank cover for easier reference. I told them that I don't want to be accused of swapping tank covers by future inspectors so I told them to put it on the tank under the cover.

    This year my truck did not require the safety inspection, just an emission test. I'm required to go to the Davis Tech center for my emission test since I'm in Syracuse and it's CNG. They told me that they need to check my tank inspection sticker. I said that it's not required since I do not need a safety inspection. They said that they can't pass me without checking my sticker and wanted to charge me a fee to remove my tank cover. I told them that the tank check in not required for emissions and no where in the emission testing procedure does it call for it, only the safety inspection calls on the tank check. I got into an heated argument with about 5 or 6 of the guys there. I finally told them that they could check the sticker but I DEMANDED it be free of charge since they could not produce any documentation of it being a requirement for emmisions.

    Last year I got in to an arguement with them since they were not able to switch my bifuel truck from CNG to gasoline. I told them that the only way to do that is run it out of CNG, there is no manual switch like the Ford trucks have. We argued some more. I told them that I could disable the CNG system and then they could check it running on gasoline, they agreed. I unplugged the CNG system which set off the check engine light. The told me that I now fail since my check engine light was on. I had to drive my truck to run it out of CNG and also to reset the light and go back and wait in line again 2 days later to finalize the test on gasoline. Needless to say I was VERY PISSED. Hundreds of these trucks on the road in Davis County and they are all required to go to the Davis Tech center and no one there has seen one before anytime in the last 10 years!!

    The guys there are a bunch of idiots.

    I passed, I got home and noticed that one of the tank cover bolts were missing. I was tempted to go back and raise hell but I didn't. Want to bet next year they try to fail me for missing one of my tank cover bolts.
    You guessed it, it's not a generic bolt, it's specialty GM only item.
    Last edited by jeepzz; 07-14-2010, 09:41 PM.

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  • cnguser
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah

    Though $75 is not cheap, it sure beats $150 for a tank inspection in Portland, Oregon...
    I doubt you will see anyone here on the forum reporting a fee for less than your $75.

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  • larrycng
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah (mandatory tank inspection)

    It is just like when you die. You don't know where or when. The tanks have be subjected to several tests that stress them in many different ways. The manufacturer is reasonably sure that it will last 15 years with failure. Some of the newer tanks will go longer. But just like you, you need to see a doctor once in a while to make sure everything is working right. You wouldn't want to die while going down the road at 70 mph and kill some one. Those of us dealing with and supporting CNG don't one of the tanks blowing (as has happened) while it is in service.

    Hope this sounds reasonable

    Larrycng

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  • Mageever
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah

    Government regulation drives up the cost of everything. I can understand the importance of this, but every 3 years on my Civic GX is ridiculous. Such rules are usually arbitrarily chosen and/or influenced by industry groups that stand to make money. I'd like to see data on at what age these tanks actually fail and what was the failure mode.

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  • vertaqua
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah

    Is there any kind of standardized fee schedule set up for this inspection or is it just up to the individual inspector. I saw on Go Natural's website they charge 75 to do the inspection, which seems like a lot. However I'm kinda new at this, just trying to be well informed before I jump into buying a CNG vehicle.

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  • desimundo
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah

    Here is a newsletter outlining the inspection procedures per UHP:

    http://publicsafety.utah.gov/safetyi...Newsletter.pdf
    Last edited by John Mitton; 06-21-2010, 10:43 AM.

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  • larrycng
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah

    Originally posted by freedml View Post
    So, this got me thinking about the 'safety inspections' themselves:

    "...recent studies find that inspections fail to improve highway safety..."

    California, with some 32 million registered vehicles, doesn't have safety inspections and doesn't have a major auto 'safety' problem that I'm aware of. The whole program is a big waste of time and money.

    Sorry Freedml, but you haven't seen what I have seen coming through the local shops and through my shop at the college when I was working. In 1973 and 74 Calif did a road side safety inspection as a test program. I spent a couple of days with them as part of my Master's Thesis. Some of the stuff that came through the lane was scary (brakes and steering especially). The vehicles were cited by the Highway Patrol (who running the check points) for equipment violations. The only thing that stuck was teh SMOG inspection. It was felt that the citizens would not put up the with cost and inconvenience. I personally would have no problem with vehicle safety inspections.

    In Germany, if your vehicle beaks down along the road, it towed, and off the road until you have it fixed. Oh, you also get a stiff fine. I didn't see a car broke down on the side of the road in the 2-1/2 week I was there in December.

    If you want to know well maintained a vehicle is, just watch the side of the road. I do equate how well a vehicle is maintained with safety.

    Larrycng
    Last edited by larrycng; 03-09-2010, 10:45 AM. Reason: think faster than I type

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  • John Mitton
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah

    I'm going to move this over to the Utah forum, and update the thread title for easier searching.

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  • Highmarker
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah

    Originally posted by freedml View Post
    It doesn't take any special training to notice big gashes or delaminated wrapping. If a tank looks like new, it doesn't have any obvious external damage.
    You obviously have not been trained on inspecting tanks especially Type IV tanks. If a Type IV tank (plastic lined with composite overwrap) has impact damage it is very difficult to determine the extent of the damage. There is no aluminum liner to support the carbon composite in the impact and sometimes delamination within the composite occurs and sometimes it does not. Refer to Lincoln Composites Inspection guidelines for further discussion. Following an impact on a Type IV tank, the outside of the tank may look like an abrasion, but in actuallity it is impact damage.

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  • freedml
    replied
    Re: New reqt Utah

    So, this got me thinking about the 'safety inspections' themselves:

    "...recent studies find that inspections fail to improve highway safety..."

    California, with some 32 million registered vehicles, doesn't have safety inspections and doesn't have a major auto 'safety' problem that I'm aware of. The whole program is a big waste of time and money.

    Leave a comment:

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