CNGPrices now all over Europe!

[cngprices]

Hi again everyone!

Well, after adding the Swedish CNG stations, I went a little crazy. Since then, I have added Poland, France, Germany, Switzerland, Netherlands, Finland, Norway, Italy, Austria and England. So CNGPrices.com now covers 13 countries!

Germany wins for having over 700 public CNG stations. Italy isn't far behind, Switzerland has a couple hundred and Austria has about 100. France has only 18. Finland is the best, though. It has 1.

So if you know anyone in those countries who drives, or might want to drive CNG, point them to the site!

Mapping the world's CNG stations,
Todd

[ZafiraCNGGermany]

Re: CNGPrices now all over Europe!

Hello,
thank you very much for adding the German CNG stations to the webpage.

I think there are a few more CNG stations in Finland(GPS coordinates and location http://www.gasum.com/home%20customer.../Location.aspx).

If you want to get in contact with some CNG-drivers in Italy,Switzerland and Austria, feel free to post a reply on the international board at the German CNG driver forumhttp://www.erdgasfahrer-forum.de/vie...f10450c47c7f44.

Greetings from Germany
Jürgen

[CNGolf?]

Re: CNGPrices now all over Europe!

Hello to all the cng-freaks!

I 've had a look at the map with all the fillingstations, but I don't know, whether there is an other advantage but keeping all together on one spot. It takes a lot of effort to start such a project, but You'll never get finished, You need helpers, who keep the data fresh. As You can see, the prices are not found on all stations, and: if I would look for a cng-station in an area, that I don't know, I would ask special maps on real paper, or I would rely on my TomTom (or similar equipment) and the POI-file in it.

cngprices.com doesn't give me maps on paper, and it doesn't give me files to put on my navigation-equipment. And I can't reach it, when I am on the road... So IMHO it is funny, and it surely is a lot of hard work, but what for?

Concerning Europe, there are several sites in the web, which will provide any customer with fresh POI-Files:
Swiss: www.erdgasfahren.ch
Germany: http://www.pocketnavigation.de/ucontent/62/5.6.59.html
Italy: www.metanoauto.com
-only some examples.

And since no one will cross Europe in one day -stupid ones may try to ;-) - no one will need all the data at one time.

And BTW:
Since Argentina and Brazil are the countries, where most cng-vehicles are on the streets, they really might be interested to get a good map.

Bye! CNGolf²

[gringostar]

Re: CNGPrices now all over Europe!

Hello Euro CNG people. Can anyone tell me please how much in Euros it is currently costing you to fill up your car and what kind of car you drive? I'd like to tell my Spanish friends.

[Gerben]

Re: CNGPrices now all over Europe!

Hi Gringostar,
I don't actually have my own CNG car. I frequently drive a company VW Touran. It can carry about 18 kg of CNG. This will take me about 300 km. A kg costs € 0.72. (See more prices on the website) Prices don't say everything though, because gas in the Netherlands and adjacent parts of Germany is of poor quality. Most Germans can drive 350 km on a full tank and pay a bit more.
I have no idea about the situation in Spain. There are plenty of cars available in Europe. Any car available in Germany can also be imported to Spain.

I've addes some Dutch stations. We are currently at 19, while we had 12 at the end of 2008. 50% growth in 3 months! The planning is 50 stations by the end of 2009, but I expect it'll be more like 25-30.
@cngprices: I used Dutch provinces as 'state' for the first few I added, without realising I didn't fill in the country anywhere. So just to let you know: Ge = Gelderland = a Dutch province, same for Fl = Flevoland.
Another station will open next week.
The best updated website (in Dutch) is www.fuelswitch.nl

[CNGolf?]

Re: CNGPrices now all over Europe!

@gringostar:
The costs are simple to calculate: One half (in Germany).
We usually calculate fluid carburant in Liter/100km, gas is calculated in Kg/100km, cng is sold in €/kg. The prices in Germany are at about 0,90€/kg and the cars need between 4 (small OEM-Fiat) and 8kg/100km (big ones like Toyota Landcruiser are at about 10kg/100km).
But it is different from one state to the other in Europe. In Switzerland the costs are nearly as high (1,20€/kg, but swiss currency, not €!) as the costs of gasoline or carburant, they look at the amount of energy in it. In France cng seems to be a little cheaper than the wellknown stuff, but it is sold in € per cubic meter.
The greatest problem You have in Spain is the wonderful big amount of 2 (in words: two!) public fillingstations in the whole big country.

Yours, CNGolf²

[cngacrossusa]

Re: CNGPrices now all over Europe!

Hello Gerben in Netherlands - - - what TERRIFIC news that public cng pumps going in at that pace!! Wow, I doubt that the entire USA had that many net new cng pumps in 2008!!

In particular, I know that Harrisburg, PA and Washington, PA both closed down their public cng pumps that I had just used in December 2007.

Curious what is driving force in Netherlands pushing the install of the public cng pumps . . . is it govmt, private investors or what?? How quickly is the number of ngv's growing . . . these OEM sold by car companies, or are there lots of conversions happening in the Netherlands?? Let us know.

Wishing that you were here in USA putting in public cng pumps in surrounding states to Oklahoma as cng is sparse once you're out of OK.

[Gerben]

Re: CNGPrices now all over Europe!

There are a lot of factors pushing this rapid development. The most important is that state and local goverments decided to subsidize the construction of these stations.
Second is fiscal support for clean cars and fuels. Taxes on CNG are especially favorable compared to those on gasoline and even LPG.
Third is ofc. that we have private companies willing to invest. Not sure what triggered them to make such a big push, because even with subsidies they didn't have such momentum in the past.
The availability of OEM CNG cars keeps increasing. Most CNG cars are OEM. Conversions are not happening much.

In the current fiscal environnement CNG is the cheapest fuel. And Dutch like cheap. An important factor supporting this favorable policy is that people seem to realize that ethanol and biodiesel from agricultural products is not realy a sustainable alternative.
The number of cars has taken about 2 years to grow by 50%, so they are falling behind now. More stations will be subsidized this year. Next year that will be over. So when those stations are built in 2010/2011, we will have about 100 stations. Station construction will probably stagnate a bit then, but 100 stations is a good basis for a country our size.

CNG is out btw. There are plans to ban CNG by 2020. Yes, you read that right: we want to ban CNG by 2020. All CNG-vehicles should then be driving on biogas. (Or natural gas with a 'green certificate' that shows that biogas is added to the gas grid elsewhere.) This is the most sustainable and affordable way for the Dutch government to meet the European biofuels directive.

[cngacrossusa]

Re: CNGPrices now all over Europe!

Awesome reply from Netherlands!!

You're right that cng should be temporary, and replaced with bng (or whatever you call compressed bio-methane). Sweden in particular is way ahead of game with Waste Water (ie the ole toilet flushes) treatment plant to produce bio-methane. Same Swedish company is doing test system in Flint, Michigan which I believe is the first Waste Water bio-methane in the USA.

Another HUGE ready source of bio-methane are cattle yards (ie dairy farmers, stockyards, etc.) which actually have up-and-running bio-methane facilities in many states across USA (Texas, Wisconsin, California, etc). Also, an easy source for bio-methane would be the poultry industry.

I'd just like to either flush, or bury in the "green muck" on floor of stockyards ALL the Big Oil guys AND Politicians who are putting up roadblocks to massive implementation of cng all across the USA!!