Home filling units for British Columbia

[aslakeview]

Hi all

I have a CNG Toyota 4Runner that we changed over in 2ooo and everything was fine up until of July of 2007 when the last NG commercial fueling station closed down in the Okanagan valley. I have been inquiring about Phil for a few years now and was waiting for it to pass CSA standards so my insurance company would still insure my home which the bank requires. Honda has purchased Phill they are not as ready to sell it to me since they are not planning on selling their cars here in BC anytime soon and do not have any trained installers here in Canada.

I have been told that Phill also pumps at 2500 psi and my tanks are only able to handle 2000 psi. Would anyone have any suggestions on how I can get my CNG truck to be able to run on it again?

The lack of demand here in BC has to do with the company who does the conversion here. I paid $5000 for my conversion with no rebates from the government, now that there is a rebate for conversion the price has now gone to $8000 with a $3000 rebate. They have killed off the incentive for anyone to do the conversion being greedy. At $2000 they would have had tons of conversions coming their way but instead they have killed off the whole system for everyone who have spent the money on CNG vehicle conversions and since there is so little demand for the pumping stations the company has stopped selling it here and I believe they have moved the available pumping stations south where there is a greater demand. I feel like moving to the US now where the thinking is far ahead of ours regarding the environment. Bloody big business sucks.

Any suggestions regarding obtaining a unit would be appreciated. Thanks, Ralph.

[cngmike]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

I was under the impression that CSA rating is the rating the Phill carried. Have you looked into a Fuelmaker FM series of compressor, more bang for the buck.
As for how to handle the pressure difference in stall a regulator before the storage tanks with a PRD (pressure relive device) to protect you and your cylinders from over filling.

[canada dave]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

ralph,u sure your system is 2000 psi?never heard of that, 3000 or 3600psi are all that ive ever seen,but hey its a strange world.lol. cngmike is right,get an fm4,and your right they wont sell us a phil in canada even though they build them an hour away from me,but they are to slow anyway.here in ontario u can lease a compressor from the gas company,heck they were even giving away a c3 fuelmaker if u bought a ngv jst to use them up.they are a little dated,but a good machine,jst fuel maker is phasing them out,so they charge more for a rebuild then the fm's.good luck!dave.

[cngacrossusa]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

Hey Canada guy, I would recommend cheap C3 Fuelmaker.

Guy I've been talking with from Ebay has access to used C3 Fuelmakers. He swears by their reliability . . . yes, can still get parts even though Fuelmaker is phasing out this older model that was replaced by FM4. Going price lately for C3 on Ebay is around $3,000. Maybe you could find a used FM4 there in Canada for a good price as well. Both of these Fuelmakers (C3 and FM4) are 3,000 psi (200 bar) compressors - - which I understand is standard across Canada. Only drawback of C3 is lower number of hours between rebuild of compressor head - - it is only 2,300 hours so if you use it a lot, you'll want to price out the compressor rebuild BEFORE you commit to buying a used C3. The newer FM4 has either 3,000 or 4,000 hour head before it needs rebuilt.

Good luck to you . . . it's a shame that Canada with vast resource of natural gas . . . AND company Fuelmaker located there, is letting cng die.

If you give up on cng, PLEASE give us fellow cng supporters here on CNGChat first chance at buying your 4Runner.

[ecti]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

I'm a Fuelmaker distributor in Manitoba, Canada. I have a complete FM4 fully rebuilt and tested with a brand new compressor module installed ready to work. The last 1 I sold to China for $5000. You can make me an offer.
I also have 3 complete R-410 remote fill panels so you can fill from inside your garage available for sale.

[Stu Man]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

Hi ECTi :

Are there any Natural gas filling points, open to the Public, in the Province of Manitoba ?

I would like to update www.cngprices.com .

Thanks

Stu Man ( from British Columbia )

[ecti]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

Nothing retail, only Fuelmakers or private stations.

[Flainx]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

Ralph,

I looked at converting my Jeep over to CNG as a test unit for a proto type compressor we are looking at building. I was told by two suppliers in Canada of conversion kits to basically leave it alone as CNG is dead in North America. They are partially right; as the problem with CNG, is to build a commercial fueling station requires at least $1,000,000.00. To do it properly you require multiple stations. The gas companies aren’t going to spend millions of dollars on fueling stations unless they get some sort of pay back. For them to get a payback, they need vehicles converted. Most people refuse to convert there cars to CNG because there is no where to fuel them. It ‘s kind of like the quote “What came first the cart or the horse”.
During the last oil crisis of the 80’s CNG started to take off, and Canada led the way in technologie. When the crisis ended and fuel prices dropped, so did the idea to convert to CNG. There were a lot of people that lost a lot of money because of CNG, so now people are a little gun shy.

Right now Pakistan, India and South America lead the world in CNG systems. I read somewhere that there are 9000 fueling stations going into Pakistan over the next few years. We get calls almost daily form over seas customers looking for CNG compressors.

If you really want to get a Fuel Maker CSA approved, phone CSA (Langley I believe) and ask what you need to get a special inspection done on a home fueling appliance. Then ask them the cost. We get CSA special inspections done all the time and they are around $600.00. Because it will be at your house, my guess is you better bring lube or it will hurt.

As far as the USA being farther ahead of us regarding their environmental thinking, I wouldn’t jump ship just yet. I do a lot of work around the world and I have seen more things that would make you cry down there then anywhere else in the world.
As far as I know, there are still more CNG stations being removed then installed in the US. It is going to take some really deep pockets in Canada and the US before you see really good infrastructure for fueling stations.

[fireice]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

Hello Flainx. I am also from B.C. and not too far from you. Im in Rossland. What are you thinking of building? Did you say a ng fueler? I assume you are into compressors. There are home fuelers available why would you build one? Im interested in getting a cng vehicle but dont have one yet. The state of the cng industry in Canada sucks. Email me if you want to chat about setting up a fueler. I am a gas fitter and have some info. Cheerrs

[Flainx]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

Hey Fireice,

We are not looking at building a home fueling compressor for a single vehicle, we are looking at building a larger unit for some of our customers to use that have natural gas pipelines running through there farm or for smaller fleets. It would be a unit that is larger then the Fuel maker, but smaller then The Ingersoll Rand NG20.
They would use it to run their farm vehicles or for small company fleets.
If you are not in the city, a good way to make a system work is to get a few people together and start a small Co-op. That way you can justify a larger industrial grade compressor, and you have a few people to split the cost with. We are lookign at converting our shop/personnel trucks over to CNG and setting up a system in our shop to test our prototype unit.
We are a good 6-9 months away from building the first prototype unit, as we have some logistical things to work out
No offence to anyone, but you couldn't pay me enough to develop a single vehicle home fueling appliance. There are reasons why Fuel Maker is the only one

[cngmike]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

Baure compressor already makes them.

http://www.bauercng.com/

[Flainx]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

So does CompAir Reavell so does LMF, now ask for a price and then ask them what delivery is? They are busy enough in the world market with there larger products that you would be lucky to get a price let alone have them build you one in less then one years time. I know what all three companies sell there small CNG packages for and they are extremly expensive.

[fireice]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

Can you give us some info on your compressor . If you can build these at a lower price this could be a good spot to promote the unit. Do you have any details?

[aDreamSoReal]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

Can you give us some info on your compressor . If you can build these at a lower price this could be a good spot to promote the unit. Do you have any details?

I'd like to know as well. I was searching for a fast fill home unit and found this site. I've got a few close friends who'd chip in for one as long as it could fill as fast as a station unit.

[Stu Man]

Re: Home filling units for British Columbia

For the record, below is an edited version of an Email reply that I received from Fuel Maker on May 22, 2008 :

Thank you for your inquiry regarding Phill and FuelMaker.

Phill is not yet commercially available in Canada. Unfortunately I do not have a timeline for its release, but when it is available in your area we will contact you. Please feel free to contact us later this year for an update if you wish.

However, you can purchase the smallest of our commercial units - FMQ-2 which has a flow/fill rate of 1 GGE per hour. Please contact our Sales Manager for more detailed information on FMQ -2.

It is unfortunate that products manufactured in Canada are not available for purchase in Canada.