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  • Cochella Valley Jeep

    Note from forum staff:
    This is a break-out thread from an original post in the Safety Forum here:
    http://www.cngchat.com/forum/showpos...&postcount=144

    ------------------------------------------------------------

    Feel free to attempt to point out their errors to them. I contacted Kathy Gottberg about their jeep when they first posted about it in February. Made a polite and informative post on their 'green forum' letting them know that they were in fact outside the laws, and potentially NOT actually being any greener, and pointed her to cngchat.com. Her response was to delete my posts and block my account on their forum. She DID apparently sign up here back in March (handle GOTTGREEN), though apparently refused to actually learn anything from here, and worse, continued to spread the misinformation that does nothing but HURT the adoption of CNG.
    Last edited by John Mitton; 09-03-2009, 05:22 PM.
    1997 Factory Crown Victoria w/ extended tanks ~~ Clunkerized!
    2000 Bi-Fuel Expedition --> ~~ Sold ~~ <--

  • #2
    Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

    Originally posted by Highmarker View Post
    You'll find that they use "emulators" to control the electronic signals between the sensors/injectors and the computer.
    Oh man, these emission control "defeat device" peddlers are aggressively prosecuted and can be subject to stiff penalties
    http://www.epa.gov/compliance/resour...aa/casper.html

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

      John, I sent a PM to Jared and Crazi, they can share it with you. I've also sent a email to the owners of the Jeep pointing out some problems (I'll pm you). I've also heard from the installer. He stated that he has corrected the problem with the tank and needs to update the pictures

      There is still the problem of the smog test on 5/6/09 (yea, I checked when it was done). From what I know of the possible system that was installed the vehicle should have failed for modification, and tampering, based on CARB Regulations and BAR procedures (I'm still a Calif SMOG Tech).

      I'll try and check the system out when I get back to the Coachella Valley around the end of Oct.

      Larrycng

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

        Does that refueling connector actually protrude from the right side, just behind the door? On the company's website, they have a parade of photos, some of them show European type fuel lines and single ferrule compression fittings, and just a few inches away are the typical Swagelok fittings. Some of the installation work shown in the photos look quite good, while in the same photo, I see a booboo.

        As for the vent bag, wouldnt the Jeep be considered an open vehicle? That would be a objective call on the part of the inspector.

        Franz

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

          Franz,

          You're right, in that it is a subjective call for the inspector. As long as the Jeep is open "all the time" it would be okay. But what about a rainy day or a cold day and they decide to close it up - then you have a problem.
          Jared.
          Mountain Green, Utah
          2003 CNG Cavalier
          2003 CNG Silverado 2500HD

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

            I would think it should only be acceptable if it was to have the top mounting bolt holes 'disabled' in some way, to at least make it 'really hard' to put a full top on there. To me, it would be easier to just properly bag the tank.

            Still, he safety issues can be fixed.. the skirting the smog laws on the other hand (especially when trying to be self-proclaimed 'green' is the annoying part)
            1997 Factory Crown Victoria w/ extended tanks ~~ Clunkerized!
            2000 Bi-Fuel Expedition --> ~~ Sold ~~ <--

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

              To whom it may concern, the pictures posted on this chat site depict the work progress of the vehicle. I probably should have posted the correct photos on the website of the finished product. The steel lines and fittings were junk, we know that !!! Those pictures were just a mockup of how it was going to go together, to see if we like where everything is positioned. The jeep received stainless lines, a quarter turn valve, proper loops and bends for the pipe, also, the fuel receptacle was recessed inward with a bigger holder, the vent bags were properly placed over all fittings off the tank. We hope not to cause a big scene, as if this vehicle was just a test for an off road vehicle to obtain more fuel on the trail. This whole thread got blown completely out of proportion. Our company's focus is not converting vehicles!!!! our focus and money efforts are to build a company that focuses on the refueling side of the industry. Thankyou.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                Originally posted by Greenline Fuel Corp. View Post
                To whom it may concern, the pictures posted on this chat site depict the work progress of the vehicle...
                OK, I give up... which vehicle are your talking about... there are 151 posts on this thread. And, your idea about posting the completed project photo is a good one, please help us out and give a post number with the new photo(s). And how did someone find your in process vehicle to take pictures in the first place?

                Thanks!
                2008 GX (extended range, trunkless version)
                Polished Metal Metallic 2012 Civic Natural Gas
                Fuelmaker FMQ-2-36 (since 2001)
                Previously owned: 2000 GX (11 years), 1995 Bi-fuel Sonoma, 2000 Bifuel Tahoe, 2000 Bi-fuel F150

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                  Originally posted by CNGfamily View Post
                  OK, I give up... which vehicle are your talking about... there are 151 posts on this thread. And, your idea about posting the completed project photo is a good one, please help us out and give a post number with the new photo(s). And how did someone find your in process vehicle to take pictures in the first place?

                  Thanks!
                  He's referring to the jeep that was the topic of the last 8 or so posts. Yes, a picture would definately be a good thing to add of the completed project, but it seems moot as the owner of the vehicle seems to think (and apparently whoever did the smog check on it) that this car is still legal to drive on public roads, and actively encourages others to do the same. That was my problem with it in Feb/March when I attempted to contact about it, and it remains my concern.
                  1997 Factory Crown Victoria w/ extended tanks ~~ Clunkerized!
                  2000 Bi-Fuel Expedition --> ~~ Sold ~~ <--

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                    Originally posted by Greenline Fuel Corp. View Post
                    To whom it may concern, the pictures posted on this chat site depict the work progress of the vehicle. I probably should have posted the correct photos on the website of the finished product. The steel lines and fittings were junk, we know that !!! Those pictures were just a mockup of how it was going to go together, to see if we like where everything is positioned. The jeep received stainless lines, a quarter turn valve, proper loops and bends for the pipe, also, the fuel receptacle was recessed inward with a bigger holder, the vent bags were properly placed over all fittings off the tank. We hope not to cause a big scene, as if this vehicle was just a test for an off road vehicle to obtain more fuel on the trail. This whole thread got blown completely out of proportion. Our company's focus is not converting vehicles!!!! our focus and money efforts are to build a company that focuses on the refueling side of the industry. Thankyou.
                    I've had a conversation with Greenline a little bit ago, and they assured me that situation shown in the picture has been conrrected; bag and PRD vent line. The fuel lines have also been replaced with stainless. Greenline assured me that it had been brought into complance with NFPA 52. I've met these guys and have no reason to doubt them.

                    Larrycng

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                      The green claim certainly doesnt hold water. The claim about CARB and the EPA certs not necessary are also false advertising, misleading, and subject to any actions imposed by air quality agencies.

                      Franz

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                        Originally posted by Franz View Post
                        The green claim certainly doesnt hold water. The claim about CARB and the EPA certs not necessary are also false advertising, misleading, and subject to any actions imposed by air quality agencies.

                        Franz
                        As said, this was my concern as well. It's one thing to have a car that you get smogged illegally.. frankly, that's been happening since the introduction of the smog check, and is something that is perhaps just an 'acceptable level' of error in the system that isn't worth fighting. However, when the vehicle in question is in fact being used as a public display of what we SHOULD be doing to be 'green', while at the same time breaking clean air laws, it sends a very bad message. Sort of makes me recall a certain politician's hydrogen and cng powered hummers... I guarantee there was no CARB cert for them as well...
                        1997 Factory Crown Victoria w/ extended tanks ~~ Clunkerized!
                        2000 Bi-Fuel Expedition --> ~~ Sold ~~ <--

                        Comment

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