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Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

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  • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

    thats exactly what i mean. if the truck has a class 3 hitch or some other sturdy crossmember behind the cylinder and the valve is forward AND not near any other frame member or axel. i mean i've never seen a frame crush like an accordion before, usually it bends in the middle near the cab.

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    • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

      Cylinders shall be permitted to be installed in other orientations where the container valve and fittings are located at the end of the container must be protected from a source of impact.------ this is vague at best. nfpa should be more clear in this area

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      • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

        Okay, I am posting these pictures to NOT make fun of the guy who did this installation, but to educate the people about proper CNG installations.

        These pictures are of a 1996 Nissan Altima that I inspected recently. The CNG kit is from the company in Argentina (we all know their name). The tanks are off of some Chrysler vehicle. They are made by Pressed Steel, but have the Chrysler symbol on them. The guy said that when he bought the tanks, the brackets came with them. The tanks are mounted in the trunk of the car. Okay here we go..

        Picture #1:
        This shows a significant gap between the bracket and the tank. With this big of gap it means that 180° around the tank is probably seeing some stress during filling. The other bracket on the tank has the same gap.

        Picture #2:
        Where do I begin...Underneath the tank, just to the left of the bracket there is a yellow strap that holds the brackets/tanks in place. There is another yellow strap on the other end of the tank. These yellow straps are tied to a 1/2" thick plywood under the carpet in the trunk. The plywood is then bolted to some aluminum plate mounted under the trunk. The problem with straps is they deteriorate over time and they are more exposed than bolts and could get damaged. Also in this picture you can see the valves and fittings are not properly vented to the outside. Also, the red cap to the left of the valve is the filling receptacle mounted inside the trunk. NFPA 52 is not clear on the proper location for mounting the filling receptacle only that it need to withstand a break-away force of 150 lbs. But one of the most common places for CNG leaks is the filling receptacle.

        Picture #3:
        To the right of the vavle and under the white tubing is the PRD. The PRD is not properly vented to the outside of the car.

        I of course did not give this guy a passing grade. Hopefully he gets these things fixed.
        Attached Files
        Jared.
        Mountain Green, Utah
        2003 CNG Cavalier
        2003 CNG Silverado 2500HD

        Comment


        • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

          Jared:

          For every one of you who does a thorough job of CNG vehicle inspections, there are a hundred who do not. And more than likely a magnitude more of people who are screaming that the government has too many controls on these vehicles, and for the government to "lighten up" the restrictions to propogate more conversions.

          So, I wonder how long this person will take to repair the installation?

          Sigh.

          Franz

          Comment


          • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

            I'm afraid you're right Franz. Part of the problem is people take short cuts in the installation process not following the kit manufacturer's instruction and them getting them tested for tail pipe emission and OBD II, let alone correct the engine/computer problems.

            Good Job Jered. Pictures like that with the actual problems and descriptions will help education the whole CNG commumity. I am surprised they put the Argentine valve on the tanks.

            Larrycng

            Comment


            • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

              Originally posted by Franz View Post
              Jared:

              For every one of you who does a thorough job of CNG vehicle inspections, there are a hundred who do not. And more than likely a magnitude more of people who are screaming that the government has too many controls on these vehicles, and for the government to "lighten up" the restrictions to propogate more conversions.

              So, I wonder how long this person will take to repair the installation?

              Sigh.

              Franz
              Franz, you are right, the folks who scream that the government has too much control are the first ones who blame it on the government when something goes wrong (i.e stock market), they cry and whine about taxes on a street corner, that was built by tax money. Its simple do the job right and don't take shortcuts. I've seen these types of issues every since I started in this business in 1993, Kevin

              Comment


              • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                What will people think of next...

                How about converting a Honda Civic? This is listed on KSL.com (see link below).

                http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=443...iew&ad=1491614

                This is a Honda Civic EX, LX, DX, or HX that has been converted to CNG. The attached picture show a few things wrong.

                1. No bagging to vent pressure connections to the outside.
                2. It appears that there is no rubber gasket between the tank and the brackets.
                3. I don't see a label. I would guess that the tank is from China and is not DOT FMVSS 304 approved.
                4. I am also not a fan of having the fill receptacle inside the vehicle.
                Attached Files
                Jared.
                Mountain Green, Utah
                2003 CNG Cavalier
                2003 CNG Silverado 2500HD

                Comment


                • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                  Naa Jared, it is a "CX" "C" is for converted. From the looks of things, he decreased the value of the vehicle. I would like to see what was used for hight pressure tubing -- bet it wasn't stainless.

                  Larrycng

                  Comment


                  • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                    Note from forum staff:
                    Responses to the following post took on a life of their own, so we have moved the posts to a new thread in the Safety Forum here:
                    http://www.cngchat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5491

                    -------------------------------------------------------------------

                    Here's one with a story:

                    The link below is about a couple that converted their 2003 Jeep to CNG. They state in their story, "And remember, EPA approval is not required if you keep the regular gas tank in place and use the vehicle as a gas/CNG hybrid".

                    http://coachellavalleygreen.com/inde...=71&Itemid=100

                    I guess you'll believe anything someone else tells you. Anyway, their conversion was done by Greenline Fuel Corporation.

                    http://greenlinefuelcorp.com/aboutus.aspx

                    From the link above you can see pictures of the Jeep's conversion. I have attached the picture that shows the tank. There is not bagging around the high pressure connections and venting them to the outside.

                    On a side note: Greenline Fuel Corporation uses CNG Interstate products based out of St. George, Utah. If you look on CNG Interstates website:

                    http://cnginterstate.com/about

                    You'll find that they use "emulators" to control the electronic signals between the sensors/injectors and the computer.
                    Attached Files
                    Last edited by John Mitton; 09-03-2009, 04:21 PM.
                    Jared.
                    Mountain Green, Utah
                    2003 CNG Cavalier
                    2003 CNG Silverado 2500HD

                    Comment


                    • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                      This tread has been quiet for a while. I didn't expect to find anything in Yucca Valley, Ca. I'll let this one speak for itself. There are several actual NFPA 52 violations and some things that would provoke some discussion. I'm staying clear of this Chevy/GMC van that is licensed in Calif. It does have a CNG diamond.

                      Have fun

                      Larrycng
                      Attached Files

                      Comment


                      • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                        How about these tanks for sale on Craigslist? I don't think I'd want these mounted in my truck.
                        Attached Files
                        www.CNGUtah.com

                        Comment


                        • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                          Originally posted by larrycng View Post
                          This tread has been quiet for a while. I didn't expect to find anything in Yucca Valley, Ca. I'll let this one speak for itself. There are several actual NFPA 52 violations and some things that would provoke some discussion. I'm staying clear of this Chevy/GMC van that is licensed in Calif. It does have a CNG diamond.

                          Have fun

                          Larrycng
                          Larry,

                          Is that the filling nozzle located between the two tanks? That is all too crazy.
                          Jared.
                          Mountain Green, Utah
                          2003 CNG Cavalier
                          2003 CNG Silverado 2500HD

                          Comment


                          • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                            Originally posted by larrycng View Post
                            I'll let this one speak for itself.
                            dude. Totally.


                            ?Innovation is driven by having access to things.? -- Gleb Budman, CEO of backblaze.com

                            Comment


                            • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                              Yes Jered, that is the fuel connector, and this isn't even Utah. Calif. is noted for being a leader in many areas.

                              Larrycng

                              Comment


                              • Re: Non-NFPA 52 conforming pictures

                                Originally posted by CNG Utah View Post
                                How about these tanks for sale on Craigslist? I don't think I'd want these mounted in my truck.
                                Amazing Stupidity !!! How quickly $3,000-4,000 in viable tanks can turn into $200-300 in scrap metal.
                                That's assuming the scrap dealer will accept them or the owner doesn't kill themselves taking the valves off.
                                Your Friendly Nazi Squirrel Administrator

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