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  • New Home Refuel Equipment

    I found this listed on ebay. http://tinyurl.com/4czdt5

    Here is their website. http://freedomfuelerusa.com/
    Newspaper Article:

    AS I SEE IT
    Written by Eugene W. White, Punxsutawney
    Friday, 18 April 2008
    EDITOR'S NOTE: Eugene W. White, who now lives in Punxsutawney, grew up in northern Indiana County, where he now owns and manages 750 acres of mostly woodland. He was a materials sciences professor at Penn State University until 1976, when he left to pursue private business research.
    Special to the Gazette

    I wish to describe how I have been using low-cost natural gas from wells on my own property to run vehicles for more than two years. Using four different vehicles, we have totaled more than 80,000 miles on compressed natural gas (CNG) with no problems.

    Let us start with the fact that natural gas wells are widely distributed throughout most of western Pennsylvania. These wells are scattered across farms and woodlands. In most of Indiana and Armstrong counties, for example, wells are separated by as little as 1,000 to 1,500 feet.

    Often as part of the lease agreements between the company that produces these wells and the owner of the "gas rights" is a provision for the owner to use a specified amount of natural gas, free of charge. Typically, this amount is 200,000 cubic feet, or 200 Mcf, per year. This equates to about 1,400 gallons of gasoline equivalent (gge) per year.


    A provision in my lease, which is quite typical, is that if I exceed my free gas allocation, then I would pay for the overrun at a so-called wellhead price. This is the price the production company gets for gas put in the pipeline. Last year, the cost of my overrun gas was about $7 per Mcf or about $1 per gge.

    Natural gas, as produced from the ground, is a premium motor fuel. With the possible exception of needing to simply remove excess moisture, it is good to go. Natural gas is the least polluting of all the transportation fuels that have been used to date. Hydrogen does promise to do better from a pollution standpoint, but one has to carefully examine how it is produced.

    Western Pennsylvania is a major producer of natural gas yet it is seldom mentioned as one of the fuels to be considered as an alternative for gasoline and diesel fuel. In 2005, Pennsylvania produced about 25 percent of the amount of energy from natural gas as from gasoline. Very little of it was used to move vehicles.

    Attempts to promote natural gas, or CNG, as a motor fuel have been made from time to time, but it has never caught on to any significant extent. The possible, but very minor exception, has been the establishment of bus fleets that run on CNG in towns such as Indiana and State College. Somehow, the cost for CNG delivered to individuals at public fill stations in Pennsylvania has always been roughly the same as for gasoline at the pump, so the added cost to own a vehicle set up to run on CNG has offered little or no payback.

    The technology for running engines and motor vehicles safely on natural gas has been well worked out and has been used to a limited extent for more than 50 years. Pennsylvania lags far behind some states in doing anything with CNG. California, Arizona and New York are much further along. In those states, one can purchase a new Honda Civic GX, for example, that is dedicated to run on CNG and can be purchased with a home CNG fill appliance that uses household natural gas for overnight refueling. There appears to be no interest by Pennsylvania car dealerships in supplying these products.

    Starting in late 2005, I began buying bi-fuel vehicles at government auctions, and by April 2006 I owned three Chevy Cavaliers and one S-10 pickup. All have low mileage and cost me an average of $5,000. So far, we have had a trouble-free cumulative CNG usage of over 80,000 miles. I purchased a FuelMaker refueling appliance for $4,000 through the Internet to compress the CNG to 3,600 psi. Before the natural gas enters this compressor, I clean it up by passing the low pressure (8 ounce) gas through a desiccation column that removes excess moisture and some of the hydrocarbons from the raw gas.

    There seems to be much more activity in northeast Ohio than in Pennsylvania. Randy Kaiser, of Kaiser Construction in Homeworth, Ohio, operates eight vehicles from a gas well on his property. He uses a natural gas compressor to fill a cascade storage system from which he can quick fill his vehicles.

    He is also working with a manufacturer that will be introducing the new Freedom Fueler refueling appliance in a couple months. It will be guaranteed for use on raw gas, will compress at twice the rate and cost about one-fourth the current list price for a new FuelMaker.

    Marc DeLuca, DeLuca Fuel Products of Coshocton, Ohio, has converted several diesel farm tractors, stationary engines and pickup trucks to run on natural gas with diesel fuel, cutting diesel consumption by up to 75 percent.

    While the major U.S. auto companies are not offering CNG vehicles, companies such as IMPCO and ECO Fuel Systems Inc. do offer courses, systems and training for mechanics to learn how to install, operate and maintain systems they provide for converting new and used vehicles to run on CNG.

    Developments since I first began using CNG more than two years ago are now coming together to make it easier for more individuals to consider using natural gas from natural gas wells on their own land to run their vehicles, farm tractors and stationary engines.

  • #2
    Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

    I found it interesting that thier website had no photos of the equipment. Nor, did they indicate how the product could be purchased.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

      So that makes the cost at $3,000 per unit when ordering 2,000 units at a time? WOW, expensive wholesale price.
      John

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

        Originally posted by Timon View Post
        So that makes the cost at $3,000 per unit when ordering 2,000 units at a time? WOW, expensive wholesale price.
        Well, other than the mysterious lack of photographic evidence, and the overly obnoxious patrio-marketing, it isn't that outrageous, considering the market it is going for. It does state it can do 2 gge/hour, so when compared with the 1 gge/hr FMQ-2-36, retailing for >10,000 with the bonus of fuelmakers wonderful customer-last policies, it really starts to sound good.

        No mention of the costs for the after-6000 hr rebuild, but 6000hr*2gge/hr will give a decent 12,000 gge, so buying a second one wold cheaper than the same number of gge would cost from fuelmaker..

        Again, this is dependant on the claims being truth... And it also makes me wonder if they are so enthusiastic about cng, why they aven't mentioned the compressor here before.
        1997 Factory Crown Victoria w/ extended tanks ~~ Clunkerized!
        2000 Bi-Fuel Expedition --> ~~ Sold ~~ <--

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

          Vaporware. They need to build 1 before they build 2000. And, if they're really going for the home fueling market, they'll need 'appliance' approval like Phill has. It took Fuelmaker years to get that and doubled the retail price of Phill.
          02 GX
          01 GX
          03 Crown Vic
          06 GX
          Home Fueler

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

            tried to send them an email to get more info at the email link on their website and the email was returned undeliverable
            sigpichttp://WWW.CNGMOTORS.COM
            SAVE TIME. SAVE MONEY. SAVE THE ENVIRONMENT.

            2003 Hummer H2 bi-fuel
            2000 GMC Yukon XL bi-fuel
            1999 International 4700 dual-fuel
            2007 Chevy Avalanche bi-fuel

            FMQ2-36 Fuelmaker w/ 24 GGE cascade

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

              Wow, 2 GGE / hour. That is close to 240 cf/h of natural gas. That doesn't seem like your typical home natural gas appliance.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

                Here was my reply from an e-mail:

                Release date for the USA in production run lots is now! You have a price of $6,000,000.00 dollars. That would be for 2000 units. So when you do the math, that is $3000.00 per unit plus shipping. Additionally, if you went to the web site FREEDOMFUELER.COM I think you would find the spec 2gge per hour/6000hr/5y/ect., and if you contact the company Energy, Inc., directly from the contact info at the end of the ad someone there will answer your questions. As far a pic of the unit, that will be shown to the public once the Freedom Fuller is put into the hands of the dealer/distribution network. If you have the funds to purchase large lots there is legal docs we have to protect you the buyer,master distributor cng4me the seller, and Energy, Inc., the manufacture.

                Thanks for looking.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

                  My guess is that they are trying to finance the manufacturing by taking orders up front. If they think they are going to get 6 million from somebody based on a tacky ebay auction they're dreaming. I guess they may find some leads though that could turn out pretty good. I would work with them on professional looking website if they really have something. You just can't tell what to make of them with all those eagle heads and cheeeeessy looking graphics.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

                    Yeah, I wish they were more professional looking. This is a product that really needs to happen. I know a lot of us here are probably drooling at the thought of getting one of these for a reasonable price, but they look like they might not be able to pull it off looking for money that way.

                    I hope they are not shooting their potential distributers in the foot, every consumer now has an idea of what they will cost the seller, and that's never good if you are trying to sell them. These are easily worth $10,000 (compared to fuelmaker) I would think they should retail for around $6000, but now everyone is going to want one for under $4000, including myself.
                    2000 Escalade (option 3 conversion) FOR SALE
                    2004 F150 XLT (OEM conversion)
                    2000 Camry (Awesome Car!!)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

                      To me, no photos=no product. I bet they are just looking for investors

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

                        So something interesting just came up. I was browsing through Craig's List just to see what was out there for Fuelmakers in Denver when I came across this link:

                        http://denver.craigslist.org/wan/820227454.html

                        Since I have a dead Phill with the chance to get it remanufactured, I replied. Well, I got a reply from Mr. Kucinski of Freedom Fuel Inc. who is interested in buying my remanufactured Phill. I'll probably end up selling my unit but it looks like everyone's suspicion is correct. They aint got nothing yet.

                        Umm, I think I incriminated too quickly. This gentleman is from Freedom Fuel, Inc. and the "new unit" is Freedom Fueler from Energy, Inc.
                        Last edited by Steve; 09-23-2008, 08:39 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

                          Originally posted by Steve View Post
                          So something interesting just came up. I was browsing through Craig's List just to see what was out there for Fuelmakers in Denver when I came across this link:

                          http://denver.craigslist.org/wan/820227454.html

                          Since I have a dead Phill with the chance to get it remanufactured, I replied. Well, I got a reply from Mr. Kucinski of Freedom Fuel Inc. who is interested in buying my remanufactured Phill. I'll probably end up selling my unit but it looks like everyone's suspicion is correct. They aint got nothing yet.

                          Umm, I think I incriminated too quickly. This gentleman is from Freedom Fuel, Inc. and the "new unit" is Freedom Fueler from Energy, Inc.
                          Even if it WAS the same guy, how does his purchase of a Phill mean that he has nothing? It's not uncommon for a competing company to purchase a competitor's product for comparisons and advertising purposes.

                          I'd say just wait to see what happens with it. Lord knows we sure need something like this. I'd be in line to buy 2 as soon as it's available.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

                            Originally posted by wrenchmonkey View Post
                            Even if it WAS the same guy, how does his purchase of a Phill mean that he has nothing? It's not uncommon for a competing company to purchase a competitor's product for comparisons and advertising purposes.

                            I'd say just wait to see what happens with it. Lord knows we sure need something like this. I'd be in line to buy 2 as soon as it's available.
                            You are absolutely correct and I hope that this new company (complete with cheesy pictures and pictureless products) has something. I would just hope that a competitor would have bought their competition's product a lot sooner in the design cycle rather than purchasing it on the cusp of releasing their own product.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: New Home Refuel Equipment

                              Why should they have purchased it sooner?

                              It's NOT something ANYBODY should try to base a design on. As I said before, rather than buying it to rip off the poor design, it's more likely that they'd be purchasing it in order to accent and demonstrate all of the failures of that product, for advertising and education purposes.

                              Comment

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