home fuel station

[Jim4racing]

I need info. on who i can get to install a home fuel station in southern california.

Thanks
Jim

[freedml]

Re: home fuel station

For the FM series, the local sales/service/installer is GESI 909-466-6920. Probably $10k and up through them.

For Phill, you should call Fuelmaker directly at 866-697-4455. They will send an installer to survey your installation. This will cost at least $5k less a possible $2k rebate from SCAQMD. I paid $900 to Kevin Shaw Plumbing for a simple installation. FM's preferred installers charge a lot more. Easy to permit but very slow fill rate and not as reliable as the FM series.

[cnghal]

Re: home fuel station

Jim,
You might also want to check out http://cngchat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1698
and other refueling threads. By fuel station do you mean Fuelmaker VRA (Phil,FMQ2-36,...) or something more involved?

[flmgrip]

Re: home fuel station

Easy to permit .

careful with that statement... read my posts about my problems....

[freedml]

Re: home fuel station

I did and there wasn't much information there.

[cnghal]

Re: home fuel station

Try SoCalGas Denied Request to Install Phill at http://cngchat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1294

[freedml]

Re: home fuel station

It is easy to get a Phill permitted. But it can't be done everywhere. Fuelmaker won't sell a Phill outside the states it markets them in. The local gas utility won't give you an approval letter if there's an antiquated law on the books that regulates the quality of natural gas used for motor fuel. Your HOA may not approve an outdoor installation or even a vent for an indoor installation. But when the answers aren't 'no' then the permitting is straightforward and easy.

[cnghal]

Re: home fuel station

The spec for CNG in most areas is at least 90% methane as it is stated on most pumps. This is, from what I have been told, why there aren't many or any stations in Ventura County due to an abundance of "hot" well gas being used. CARB does not consider it a motor fuel unless it has the proper amount of methane. As for Fuelmaker, the last thing you want to do is run hot, sour, or wet gas thru a non-lubricated compressor. Not to mention the potential damage to steel system parts and tanks in the vehicles from hydrogen sulfide(sour gas) or carbonic acid(high dew point and CO2 in gas). Also compressing some of the components of well gas (heptane, pentane, ethane, propane, butane, CO2) can cause them to condense to a liquid. Again Fuelmakers and most CNG compressors are not built to handle compressing liquids.
So I think we're talking more about science and reallity, than some govenment/gas company conspiracy.

[freedml]

Re: home fuel station

If you want to argue 'the merits' then limit your argument to 'hot' gas. SCGas is not wet or sour and no one has asserted that it is. This is mostly an issue if you have your own well on your property.

I believe we're talking the difference between 90% Methane and 88% Methane -- in other words, not a significant difference. I think users should have the (informed) choice to use 'hot gas' and perhaps get less life out of their compressors than be denied the choice.

[Curtis]

Re: home fuel station

Ever wonder how a public station in an area that is serviced by "hot gas" is able to sell you gas? They apply for a waiver. They submit a ton of data on the gas content to the PUC, ask for a waiver on the merits of being a "test".

The fact is that individuals can do the same thing. We just don't know the forms, proceedures and loop holes that must be traversed to do it. I will shortly be compiling the info, for you that have run into this delima, so that you can do the same thing that the fleets, utilities and others, have been doing for decades in area's that have "hot gas".

It's neither quick, or easy, but I think there are some among you that would be willing to run the proverbial gauntlet. Just let me get past the cruise-in before you start bugging me about it, ok?

[cnghal]

Re: home fuel station

Ok Curtis,
But start on it the Monday after Thunder, we don't want you slacking off and thinking about having a life. Chop,Chop!

[Curtis]

Re: home fuel station

Ok Curtis,

But start on it the Monday after Thunder, we don't want you slacking off and thinking about having a life. Chop,Chop!

I'm in the "no danger of that" program there. I have more irons in the fire than a TV chef.