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AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

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  • ajgiorgi
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    Originally posted by lcovelli View Post
    I agree that Prius or any gas electric Hybrid should be phased out of the HOV lane. The plugin hybrid is another futile attempt and SB535 as is amended will be a move backward as the incentive will just promote people's admiration for a little car that can't..

    However, if a Plug-in Prius was CNG-Electric, that would be totally worth it. Honda would take the cake on this one as the engineering with the civic GX and the civic hybrid would just mean strapping some batteries where the gas tank used to be and dropping the engine down to 1.5L to make room for the EV.
    I totally agree! If your solo, its either electric, CNG, or a motorcycle. That's it. That would help out the traffic in the carpool lane. Maybe people will actually start carpooling with their gas cars......maybe.
    Last edited by ajgiorgi; 07-16-2010, 02:24 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • CaptJeff
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    Originally posted by Curtis View Post
    Here's a summary:
    By Gary Richards

    mercurynews.com

    Posted: 07/07/2010 05:45:52 PM PDT
    Updated: 07/07/2010 10:11:02 PM PDT


    CARPOOL PERKS IN TWO BILLS

    AB 1500

    Signed Wednesday by governor
    Allows electric vehicles and others running on alternative fuels to keep white carpool stickers until Jan. 1, 2015
    There are more than 9,000 vehicles with white stickers now, and there is no limit

    SB 535
    Goes back to Senate Transportation Committee later this summer
    Would allow electric cars, those that run on compressed natural gas and plug-in hybrids to apply for 40,000 green carpool stickers
    Perk would be in place until Jan. 1, 2015

    Owners of hybrids who currently have yellow stickers would be allowed access to carpool lanes until July 1, 2011, instead of Jan. 1, 2011
    This data appears to be inaccurate, as AB1500 provides for White Stickers to be issued and the benefits to continue until 2015 of SUELEV(or better which ATPZEV is) which also meet ILEV standards. THis means PURE Electrics, CNG and Hydrogen.

    SB535 is worded for "Enhanced ATPZEV" which hasn't really been defined but it does NOT require ILEV, thereby allowing vehicles that also consume gasoline in their category. I believe that there will be more ammendments to that bill.

    It's not a good thing if it passes as currently amended. It is being downgraded so Toyota can get their 10-12 Mile plug in Prius back in the carpool lanes.
    Jeff

    Leave a comment:


  • lcovelli
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    Maybe Chevrolet can provide some political lobbying downplaying the prius push for SB535 along with our efforts.

    Leave a comment:


  • CaptJeff
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    I like what you're thinking, but what can make more difference is very thorough and diplomatically written letters to ALL legislators involved.
    NOT, blah, blah, blah CNG vehicles only, MUCH more thorough.

    CNG, ELECTRIC (a larger force right now for the next year with the Leaf about to hit) and Hydrogen are the most advanced technologies, that require substantial effort on the user's behalf, make a substantial improvement in air quality, and all meet the FEDERAL ILEV standards.

    Vehicles that were previously referred to as "hybrids" and plug in hybrids, (Hybrid propulsion vehicles and similar vehicles with added batteries to provide some EV only range, but no significant Highway range) do not require any substantial paradigm change, and simply will do little to benefit the overall air quality improvement.

    These vehicles, while good and efficient do not in any way need or deserve the ultimate incentive of single occupant HOV lane access. Allowing them single occupant access to the HOV lanes only serves to insure their manufacturer bigger profits and meeting of their already in place sales forecasts. Also the incentives given inappropriately like this raises retail prices and serves to significantly stagnate the advancement of the true clean fuel vehicles that they had hoped to incentivize and foster acceptance of.

    When the Yellow sticker Hybrids were given HOV access, this action served to set back almost 5 years the advancement and adoption of CNG vehicles, superior Electric Only vehicles and very futuristic Hydrogen vehicles.

    SB 535 will once again (since it was recently severely dilluted) serve priimarily to put tens of thousands of very weak plug in hybrids into the carpool lane, again significantly degrading the value of the incentive towards promoting advanced technologies.
    The 'next gen Prius' that is purported to have a 10-12 mile Electric only range, (I have no idea if it has any real freeway range) seems to be just a move by Toyota to lightly dabble in the plug in Hybrid arena. On the other hand, the Chevrolet Volt is WAY beyond this in technology and has PURE 100% Electric drive, and is a true EREV. (Extended Range Electric Vehicle). THis term has become significant with the entry into the 'plug-in' arena of products like a low mileage plug in Prius. A Volt is so far above the Prius, they are in different leagues.

    Personally I can see a shortened incentive for a vehicle like the Volt, (~45 mile freeway EV range, 45-50 MPG thereafter, & Higher cost).

    I can see the attempt of the SB535 as written (dilluted) as nothing more than an attempt by Toyota, seeing their Prius base going away towards Nissan's Leaf, and the Civic GX, to retain their customers.

    Work toward modifying or stopping this terrible bill.
    Jeff

    Leave a comment:


  • lcovelli
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    Originally posted by Curtis View Post
    Here's a summary:
    By Gary Richards

    mercurynews.com

    Posted: 07/07/2010 05:45:52 PM PDT
    Updated: 07/07/2010 10:11:02 PM PDT


    CARPOOL PERKS IN TWO BILLS

    AB 1500

    Signed Wednesday by governor
    Allows electric vehicles and others running on alternative fuels to keep white carpool stickers until Jan. 1, 2015
    There are more than 9,000 vehicles with white stickers now, and there is no limit

    SB 535
    Goes back to Senate Transportation Committee later this summer
    Would allow electric cars, those that run on compressed natural gas and plug-in hybrids to apply for 40,000 green carpool stickers
    Perk would be in place until Jan. 1, 2015

    Owners of hybrids who currently have yellow stickers would be allowed access to carpool lanes until July 1, 2011, instead of Jan. 1, 2011
    For SB535 and CNG vehicles with existing white stickers.. Would we be able to apply for the green stickers as well? Since dedicated EV's and NGV's get the white sticker, I would apply for the green one as well just to take a prius off the HOV lane.

    Leave a comment:


  • Curtis
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    Here's a summary:
    By Gary Richards

    mercurynews.com

    Posted: 07/07/2010 05:45:52 PM PDT
    Updated: 07/07/2010 10:11:02 PM PDT


    CARPOOL PERKS IN TWO BILLS

    AB 1500

    Signed Wednesday by governor
    Allows electric vehicles and others running on alternative fuels to keep white carpool stickers until Jan. 1, 2015
    There are more than 9,000 vehicles with white stickers now, and there is no limit

    SB 535
    Goes back to Senate Transportation Committee later this summer
    Would allow electric cars, those that run on compressed natural gas and plug-in hybrids to apply for 40,000 green carpool stickers
    Perk would be in place until Jan. 1, 2015

    Owners of hybrids who currently have yellow stickers would be allowed access to carpool lanes until July 1, 2011, instead of Jan. 1, 2011

    Leave a comment:


  • lcovelli
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    I agree that Prius or any gas electric Hybrid should be phased out of the HOV lane. The plugin hybrid is another futile attempt and SB535 as is amended will be a move backward as the incentive will just promote people's admiration for a little car that can't..

    However, if a Plug-in Prius was CNG-Electric, that would be totally worth it. Honda would take the cake on this one as the engineering with the civic GX and the civic hybrid would just mean strapping some batteries where the gas tank used to be and dropping the engine down to 1.5L to make room for the EV.

    Leave a comment:


  • lasnowgirl
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    I am SOOOOO happy right now!!! At least, we do not have to worry about it for another 4 years. Thank you Ted Lieu for introducing the bill, Arnold for signing it, and all of you for pushing them for it! YAY YAY YAY!!!!!!!

    Leave a comment:


  • johnson12345
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    Originally posted by gassipper View Post
    ***More importantly, RE the original post about SB1500, has anyone noticed that the legislation says only SULEV/ILEV vehicles get the white sticker, but when you go to CARB's website, the state lists the civic GX as neither, but as a APTZEV (same as hybrid). I called them to ask if the white sticker would be extended/issues for the GX still and they had no idea, they needed to research and said to check the webiste for any changes in classification.*** Remember the state is fairly inept.
    So to quote the AB 1500 law:

    "(1) A vehicle that meets California's super ultra-low emission
    vehicle (SULEV) standard for exhaust emissions and the federal
    inherently low-emission vehicle (ILEV) evaporative emission standard,
    as defined in Part 88 (commencing with Section 88.101-94) of Title
    40 of the Code of Federal Regulations.
    (2) A vehicle that was produced during the 2004 model-year or
    earlier and meets California's ultra-low emission vehicle (ULEV)
    standard for exhaust emissions and the federal ILEV standard. "

    To figure out which cars meet California's SULEV definition, you need to know the difference between SULEV, LEV, ULEV, ATPEZ, and ZEV.

    LEV: Low Emission Vehicle. All new cars sold in California starting in 2004 have at least a LEV emissions rating.

    SULEV: Super Ultra Low Emission Vehicle. SULEVs are 90% cleaner than the average new model year car.

    PZEV: Partial Zero Emission Vehicle. PZEVs meet SULEV tailpipe emission standards, have zero evaporative emissions and a 15 year / 150,000 mile warranty on its emission control components. No evaporative emissions means no unburned fuel escapes from the fueling system.

    AT PZEV: Advanced Technology Partial Zero Emission Vehicle. AT PZEVs meet the PZEV requirements and have additional "ZEV-like" characteristics. A dedicated compressed natural gas vehicle, or a hybrid vehicle with engine emissions that meet the PZEV standards would be an AT PZEV.

    ZEV: Zero Emission Vehicle. ZEVs have zero tailpipe emissions and are 98% cleaner than the average new model year vehicle. These include battery electric vehicles and hydrogen fuel cell vehicles.

    In other words, LEV is the worst in terms of emissions, while ZEV is the best. CNGs are AT PZEV which have less emissions that SULEV and thus meet requirements for the white sticker. CNGs have nearly zero emissions! If the person you spoke to at ARB doesn't know, call them back and fax them their factsheet before they get confused and start denying white stickers to CNG vehicles.

    www arb ca gov/msprog/zevprog/factsheets/driveclean.pdf (put a period in the spaces -- stupid website won't let me post a URL)

    PZEV, AT PZEV, and ZEV all meet requirements of SULEV and are cleaner that SULEV vehicles!

    Leave a comment:


  • gassipper
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    Also this SB535 doe snto take effect until 2012 and by then the 10 freeway and 110 freeway in LA will be HOT lanes, further reducing any incentive to get ANY of these cars. It will also be a rush to the door to see who can get which behicle fiorst, as they are all on dofferent timelines, waiting lists, etc.

    ***More importantly, RE the original post about SB1500, has anyone noticed that the legislation says only SULEV/ILEV vehicles get the white sticker, but when you go to CARB's website, the state lists the civic GX as neither, but as a APTZEV (same as hybrid). I called them to ask if the white sticker would be extended/issues for the GX still and they had no idea, they needed to research and said to check the webiste for any changes in classification.*** Remember the state is fairly inept.

    Leave a comment:


  • CaptJeff
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    Originally posted by johnson12345 View Post
    There is a second law pending SB 535 which would allow 40,000 green stickers for plug-in hybrids till 1/1/2015 and extend the yellow stickers for regular hybrids to 7/1/2011. This has not yet passed.... I don't believe there is a limit to the white/silver stickers (AB 1500) for CNG or electric vehicles.
    There is NOT a limit on the white stickers for ILEV's.
    This SB535 is a VERY bad idea. It was not a bad concept to include REAL
    EREV's (Extended Range Electric Vehicles) that have a substantial benefit and require incentives, but the way it was recently watered down it would allow very weak PHEV's such as the Prius gen 3.

    This is nothing more than another attempt to put an almost 100% gasoline vehicle into the carpool lanes (single occupant) again. It was a major F'up the first time, and would only serve to line the pockets of Toyota, raise dealer prices, and Delay the advancement of true clean fuel vehicles. It pretty much removed almost all incentive for people to get EV's and CNG's, and advance infrastructure.

    It is known that if weak hybrids were not given the HOV gift, the proliferation and state of the technology in CNG's and EV's/EREV's would be much farther along.
    So for the common person, why step up to a true Clean Fuel Vehicle if you can just buy another gasoline car (Prius)? A 10-12 mile plug in range is a total Joke. Now the Volt, with a 45 mile range and something like 45 mpg there after COULD require some incentives, as it is an EREV vs the Prius a PHEV. The Volt is 100% Electric drive. (and it is a lot more expensive, and worth it. I've driven it)

    This SB535 NEEDS to be ammended or stopped.

    I have been involved and driven Electric Vehicles since the inception of the EV-1, brought several very significant EV charging/parking benefits to the community. I have fully supported CNG's and related infrastructure since GM took back my 3rd EV-1.
    Once you drive pure EV and it fits a major part of your life style, you come to realize how superior it is. For longer missions, CNG certainly holds the superior capability and I drive the GX as my only car.

    I am working with the folks who are involved in supporting Plug-ins to take a stance against this destructive bill.

    For those who like the Prius, I do too. I rent one when over I'm in need of a rental and I can get one. It's a high mileage gasoline car, and shouldn't get the HOV lane benefit, because:
    it has no need for the incentive, and merely serves to destroy the value of the incentive to push for major advancement of TRUE Clean Fuel Vehicles. Driving CNG's and EV's requires some paradigm shift and effort in their adoption. To get people to get off their parked positions and do something requires high value incentives. This is just that incentive.
    Aloha,
    Jeff

    Leave a comment:


  • johnson12345
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    Originally posted by ajgiorgi View Post
    I was reading that we may be getting green stickers, instead of our white ones. I hope they mail out replacements and we don't have to fill out another form and wait for the DMV. Only 40,000 available. I think it was for electrics, NGV's, and plug in hybrids? Not sure about the plug in Hybrids, but NGV's and electrics for sure.
    There is a second law pending SB 535 which would allow 40,000 green stickers for plug-in hybrids till 1/1/2015 and extend the yellow stickers for regular hybrids to 7/1/2011. This has not yet passed.... I don't believe there is a limit to the white/silver stickers (AB 1500) for CNG or electric vehicles.

    Leave a comment:


  • ajgiorgi
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    Originally posted by lcovelli View Post
    Green Stickers? Where did you read this information. Please post a link.
    Thanks!
    Here it is. Scroll to the bottom of the page. Under the highlights.
    http://www.mercurynews.com/mr-roadsh...urce=autofeed#

    Leave a comment:


  • lcovelli
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    Originally posted by mathewbeall View Post
    This just extends the date for existing stickers though right? It doesn't open any more, for example, when I get my Leaf end of this year/early next year, I won't be able to apply for a sticker will I?

    Matt
    The DMV site has white stickers available but the are numbered.

    Leave a comment:


  • p71
    replied
    Re: AB 1500 signed by governor!!!

    iMiev - OK - but don't run the air conditioner

    Leave a comment:

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