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Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

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  • #16
    Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

    My 07 Civic wasn't $28k, it was $23k, and I get $4k back. Thats $19k. The fuel costs half, and I wind up saving $.05 a mile the first 100k miles compared to a Honda Fit, against a Civic, its more. After that, my savings go up.

    How about if I tell you that instead of supporting dictators that hate us, I am supporting out local economy? Saving the planet? Driving a safer car? Are you driven ONLY by your wallet?

    When I need to merge, and I floor it, I can hit the speed limit before the end of the ramp. Its not 300hp, but its ample. I have had mine upto 110mph before I lifted. My 03 gas civic cut out at 104mph. How fast do you have to go? :-)

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    • #17
      Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

      Originally posted by advocate View Post
      My view is that CNG is a short term solution until a viable electric vehicle comes into production. Don't get me wrong, I like my CNG Civic, but I'd like it even more if I could plug it into my house outlet and get 100 miles a day.
      That's what I plan on doing. Sell my CNG in a couple of years and put the money as a BIG down payment and buy a electric commuter car. (Maybe a 2010 Nissan Denki cube or a Mitsu IMIEV) Luckily, I bought my 99 in May of 07, before the market went up.

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      • #18
        Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

        Keep an eye on the metals market, neighbors. Your CNG car may be more economically replaced by another one NG ride than by a battery-powered unit, especially if we start adding more big batteries into the power grid.

        For my money, I will bet on NG with adsorbtion storage (ANG). Idarussky, I have almost finished the description of the system that I promised a month or so back...
        Last edited by Andy-Paul; 07-10-2008, 08:42 PM. Reason: misplaced smiley

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        • #19
          Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

          Originally posted by Highmarker View Post
          dkellas,

          People just don't do the math. If you pay $10K or more for a 2001 or 2002 Chevy Cavalier CNG. Look at www.edmunds.com and you'll find that you could buy the same vehicle (gasoline only) for about $3,500. $6,500 will buy you 1,625 gallons of gasoline at $4/gal. And at 30 miles/gal you will go 48,750 miles on that $6,500. That is about 3 - 4 years of driving. People just don't do the math.
          for some people, I drive 30,000 miles per year. That car would pay for its self fast in the hands of a high milage driver.

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          • #20
            Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

            Originally posted by Andy-Paul View Post
            Keep an eye on the metals market, neighbors. Your CNG car may be more economically replaced by another one NG ride than by a battery-powered unit, especially if we start adding more big batteries into the power grid.

            For my money, I will bet on NG with adsorbtion storage (ANG). Idarussky, I have almost finished the description of the system that I promised a month or so back...
            Thanks I shall look forward to it. I have high hopes for the technology.

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            • #21
              Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

              For such a new technology, I would be shocked if it became commercially available in less than 5 years. Make it 10 for incorporation into production NGVs.
              02 GX
              01 GX
              03 Crown Vic
              06 GX
              Home Fueler

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              • #22
                Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

                Not really much to implement here, other than a change to fast filling procedures (like not using them. hehe) For those with a slow fill, this could be a simple add-on type system, which could give you more range. The pellets themselves are nothing new, and have been used for other means (usually filtering) for years. This is just matter of enough people giving it a shot and some procedures to be worked out.
                1997 Factory Crown Victoria w/ extended tanks ~~ Clunkerized!
                2000 Bi-Fuel Expedition --> ~~ Sold ~~ <--

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                • #23
                  Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

                  Oh. Ok. Then make that 10 to 20 years...
                  02 GX
                  01 GX
                  03 Crown Vic
                  06 GX
                  Home Fueler

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                  • #24
                    Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

                    What is missing from the ROI calculations is the very high probability that gas supplies will be interrupted by world events. Does anybody remember the gas rationing in 1974 when were on importing 24% foreign oil ? Now that the number is 70% imagine the consequences. CNG vehicles would be able to avoid this situtation completely - factor that !

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                    • #25
                      Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

                      that's gasOLINE supplies.
                      02 GX
                      01 GX
                      03 Crown Vic
                      06 GX
                      Home Fueler

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

                        Originally posted by Highmarker View Post
                        dkellas,

                        People just don't do the math. If you pay $10K or more for a 2001 or 2002 Chevy Cavalier CNG. Look at www.edmunds.com and you'll find that you could buy the same vehicle (gasoline only) for about $3,500. $6,500 will buy you 1,625 gallons of gasoline at $4/gal. And at 30 miles/gal you will go 48,750 miles on that $6,500. That is about 3 - 4 years of driving. People just don't do the math.
                        Depreciation is key here. The true cost of something is only the amount lost from the time of purchase to the time of sale. Since the vehicles are not only keeping their value, they are in most cases appreciating. The cost of ownership is an initial investment. Add up all of the fuel saving during the time of usage and then sell the vehicle at market value to determine how much your really saving.

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                        • #27
                          Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

                          Used CNG cars are appreciating now, but that may or may not continue. Those of us who bought CNG cars months or years ago were lucky (or smart ) But, you DO know absolutely that you are saving $1-$2-$3 or more on every gallon of fuel you use TODAY. A bird in the hand...
                          02 GX
                          01 GX
                          03 Crown Vic
                          06 GX
                          Home Fueler

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

                            I agree Freedml - and above everything else... when we are nearing the end of life and our grandkids ask " Hey Grandpa, did you ever do anything to help my generation solve the environmental problems this planet faces"? And we look at them and say "Naw, it came down to a decision to spend the extra money on purchasing a clean burning CNG vehicle or just stick with my gas burning polluter". "Oh, so what did you do Grandpa"? Well
                            I figured I could buy the same vehicle (gasoline only) for about $3,500. $6,500 will buy you 1,625 gallons of gasoline at $4/gal. And at 30 miles/gal you will go 48,750 miles on that $6,500. That is about 3 - 4 years of driving.
                            How long must we all wait to change
                            This world bound in chains that we live in?
                            To know what it is to forgive,
                            And be forgiven?
                            It's been too many years of talking now.
                            Isnt it time to stop somehow?
                            Air thats too angry to breathe, water our children can't drink
                            You've heard it hundreds of times
                            You say your aware, believe, and you care, but...
                            Do you care enough
                            To talk with conviction of the heart?

                            Kenny Loggins - Conviction of the Heart

                            Sorry Kid!!!

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                            • #29
                              Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

                              I have to speak out against the people "doing the math".
                              Lets look at it in a broader/different perspective. Lets say 2 individuals buy the same rig, one is a gasoline_____, the other spends the extra $$$ for a CNG powered____. Then gas goes up to $8/gallon. All the sudden Mr. gas doesn't have enough monthly income to make ends meet anymore, and gets to choose between eat/pay mortage/drive to work.

                              We all invest to make more money and get ahead, but sometimes we have to invest just to stay afloat during hard times.....

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                              • #30
                                Re: Are We All Killing A Great Idea?

                                I'm very concerned as I read posts focusing on price per gge as the motivating factor. Prices change, economics change. If that's your reason for being here, you might be gone next week/month/year. Factors like geopolitics and the environment tend to be longer lasting, more stable issues.

                                Right now, the price of gasoline has dropped below $4 per gallon (national average). I wonder how many SUV drivers will be happily roaring down the road tomorrow thinking that they "dodged a bullet"?
                                Robert '07 GX

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