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  • Diesel - CNG 50-50 duel fuel



    It has taken me some time, but I have put together a CNG system on my 2000 Cummins. I am trying to run a 50-50 mixture of CNG to Diesel. However, I know I am getting much less than that. The regulator that I am using is connected to my alternator bracket, and only has to travel about 6 inches to my intake. I have used the largest fittings and hoses possible to allow the most flow of CNG, but I don't think I am getting enough suction to the regulator to release more CNG. I believe this is so because I have a massive air filter, along with a bigger turbo.
    I took it to a guy here in Utah to check it out, and he said not to adjust the main screw on the regulator and just leave it be. So, what can I do from here to get more CNG? I am not getting any real mpg or power increase!
    Thank you for any help!
    Last edited by Lakewood90712; 01-27-2018, 05:58 AM. Reason: Moderator note , created new thread for the poster

  • #2
    I am not at all a mechanic, but if you are experimenting with mixing cng or propane in with diesel, get an exhaust gas temp gauge installed if you don't already have one. You don't want to become a member of the " Melted Pistons Club " . A few of the members here have done these setups. Cowboy and CNG Motors have done these rigs.

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    • #3
      I have an EGT gauge setup right on my exhaust manifold! I know the CNG should be increasing my EGTs, but it isn't, also leading me to believe that I am not getting enough cng.

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      • #4
        Cummins24 - I have one vehicle that is not a dedicated or bi-fuel vehicle currently, 2005 Ford F350 Utility bed with 6.0L PowerStroke diesel. I bought this vehicle for moving my 11,500 lb skid steer around. With gasoline and Diesel on the way up in price I was contemplating whether it would make sense to buy one of these kits that claims 50/50 diesel/cng while above idle. Not sure whether you were able to get the balance you desired or the performance you wanted but I was curious whether you were able to get your system working. I did put an after-market conversion kit on a 95 F350 gas truck in the past that I used for non-road use only but I have never messed with a diesel/cng vehicle. What system were you using? Did you ever get it to work reasonably? I seem to recall that the regulator needs to be appropriately sized to handle the load from a big engine but I'm not sure the same dynamics are in play for a mixed fuel versus a single fuel source. I'm assuming you installed the system without interfacing with the ECM or ECM sensors but I might be making a bad assumption. I'm guessing these systems just dump more cng in the intake as the pressure drops in the intake. If you have any insight please share it. Currently CNG around here is 2.5 times less ... well that is comparing GGE with gallon of gasoline not diesel.

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        • #5
          first off let me say I have heard nothing good about the 6.0 . head stud problems are the main one I have heard .when you go duel fuel you are increasing the fuel rate.so if you are going to do this you will want to change the head bolts out to a high end stud kit you should be able to find them at the high pro diesel shops. also you will need a pyrometer so you dont join the melted piston club I have built several duel fuel class 8 trucks and have had nothing but good luck and saved many dollers

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          • #6
            Joe_kan, sorry for the delayed response. I did get it working thanks to cowboys help! Worked like a charm. Increased spool time, helped with fuel mileage, and over all power. No interface with the ECM at all. I ended up using Grimspeed kit, and just sourced my own regulator.
            However, as cowboy said, the 6.0 may not be the best platform to use CNG on if it isnt studded, egr deleted, etc. The CNG will increase cylinder pressures and for a stock 6.0, that is the last thing it needs.

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            • #7
              cowboy/Cummins24 - I bought the truck last year and it was being used by a school district as a irrigation/grounds maintenance vehicle. It only had 65K on it. I needed something to move around my track loader, I don't believe the truck saw any heavy hauling. Good thing because the exhaust gas cooler was starting to leak (white smoke). I replaced the cooler with a better designed one (after-market) and put newer design oil cooler in. Also put in a coolant filter. I did not pull the heads and put in the ARP head studs because they had not lifted and only the EGR cooler was problematic. To do heads properly in this truck the cab should be lifted. It has been running fine since this work was done and I do take my trailer and track loader out when needed. Personally, I believe the main flaw with the Power Stroke 6.0L is the EGR cooler design that fails and causes an overheat which lifts the heads. Lots of people doing the bullet-proofing but not really understanding root cause. I agree - if the heads lift, new head gaskets and ARP head studs should be installed.

              I'm trying to understand why a diesel/CNG blend would result in higher cylinder pressures. I can understand why it might increase temperatures since CNG provides less lubrication. Assuming this might be why the pressures may be greater? When I bought the truck I did not have much experience with diesels or the 6.0 but I'm generally a quick study and had I known the 6.0s were causing people trouble I would have got something different. Diesel prices are on the march upward and I was thinking this may be a solution. I could install one of those little meters (plugs into OBD port) that provides temperature information to keep myself out of trouble. The truck is running well an I would hate to tear into it just to allow CNG blend. I have some tanks, plumbing, and regulators so I thought it would not cost me much.

              It would really suck if I the truck blew the heads or worse. Starting to rethink the possibilities here. Thanks for the information.

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              • #8
                ok the reason for higher cylinder pressures is that adding cng is the same as turning up the fuel rate like on the old 855 cummins turn the up too much and you get to change head gaskets as they have a problem with the heads walking around they do a good job still have a few today .but when you add more fuel be it diesel or cng the reason you go faster is a bigger bang in the cylinder as it pushs the piston down it pushs the head up( equal and opposite reaction) I think the only motor that ford made any worse is the 6.4 if anybody gives you one run do not walk

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                • #9
                  I think I'm going to forget about blending the fuel on this truck (2005 F350 6.0L). I previously thought that it would not be too much trouble since I have the tank, brackets, regulator, plumbing, and fittings from a previous project truck and that project truck (gas engine, non road use) worked fine but I sold it off and still have all the CNG components I took off of it. I have a need for the f350 so I don't want to screw that up - the f150 will not tow 14K+ and that is the only other truck I have presently. A new truck is money I don't want to spend.

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                  • #10
                    the motor you want is the old 6.9 and 7.3 ford with a stick and cng you could get in the mid 20s towing and low 30s using just to ride around gutless pig on diesel fair power with mix getting hard to find these old trucks today

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                    • #11
                      Cowboy - I did run across a 2002 F350 7.3L 4x4 with only 45,000 miles two weeks ago. The local fire department was selling it on Purple Wave. It was in excellent shape and sold for $21,000 plus purple waves 10% commission (over $23k total). I don't want one of those 300k miles or more trucks - too much maintenance work. I bought my 2005 F350 4x4 with 65K miles for around $7.5K and put another $2k in fixes/improvements. I just cannot justify 20 grand for a truck to move the loader around once every few weeks. I was considering a new F250 4x4 diesel to replace both trucks but that was in the $60K+ range. Been running everything on CNG exclusively except the 2005 F350 for the past month. Guess I'm going to continue to pay over $3/gallon for diesel and still increasing when I pull the bigger truck out.

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                      • #12
                        me thinks that that is a good move you can still buy a lot of diesel for 23000 or 60000 dollars

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