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  • #16
    Re: Cng vs gasoline

    Here in California, my main reason for buying a CNG Civic was to get access to HOV lane driving solo and the car is only used for commuting. Probably a majority of California CNG Civic owners have same reason. We now know the access (via white HOV stickers) lasts for 5 years at least or until 2019.

    The side benefit of saving $75/month or $900/year on gasoline when using the car for commuting 4-5 days/week is a nice bonus.


    Note: current regular gasoline is about $4.60/gallon versus CNG at $2.27. (ooops, correction for my fat finger typing, sb $3.60 for regular gasoline)
    Last edited by GX-SV; 02-06-2014, 04:29 PM. Reason: pricing - gasoline vs. CNG
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    • #17
      Re: Cng vs gasoline

      Originally posted by GX-SV View Post
      Here in California, my main reason for buying a CNG Civic was to get access to HOV lane driving solo and the car is only used for commuting. Probably a majority of California CNG Civic owners have same reason. We now know the access (via white HOV stickers) lasts for 5 years at least or until 2019.

      The side benefit of saving $75/month or $900/year on gasoline when using the car for commuting 4-5 days/week is a nice bonus.


      Note: current regular gasoline is about $4.60/gallon versus CNG at $2.27.
      $4.60 for gasoline ?????????????????

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      • #18
        Re: Cng vs gasoline

        Ooops, typo on my part, sb more like in San Jose Chevron regular $3.579 yesterday, Chevron premium another $0.15 to $0.20.
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        • #19
          Re: Cng vs gasoline

          All, or most of the small cars offered in Europe are bi-fuel and if Civic was bi-fuel that will solve my dilemma. I understand that Civic was build to comply with CARB rules, but I do not understand why bi-fuel was not offered in no CARB states. In the past savings from using cng justified relatively limited use of long distance gasoline car, but right now I do not see any reason why I should not use my gasoline car for local commute, and long distance. We do not have HOV lines, tailpipe GHG according to EPA is 218 g/mile for cng, 200 for hybrid and 268 for gasoline Civic (I may consider trading gasoline for hybrid or plug in).

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          • #20
            Re: Cng vs gasoline

            for me the cost was simple driving my 2012 civic 35,000+ miles a year and home fueling and carpool access ....last month my gas bill was about 100$ this covers my 5 burner gas stove, gas water heater, and heating for a 3300 sq ft home (5 adults who cook alot at home) and fuel for driving about 3000 miles a month

            economics are simple, why more people arent doing this it boggles my mind

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            • #21
              Re: Cng vs gasoline

              Originally posted by exLeaf View Post
              All, or most of the small cars offered in Europe are bi-fuel and if Civic was bi-fuel that will solve my dilemma. I understand that Civic was build to comply with CARB rules, but I do not understand why bi-fuel was not offered in no CARB states. In the past savings from using cng justified relatively limited use of long distance gasoline car, but right now I do not see any reason why I should not use my gasoline car for local commute, and long distance. We do not have HOV lines, tailpipe GHG according to EPA is 218 g/mile for cng, 200 for hybrid and 268 for gasoline Civic (I may consider trading gasoline for hybrid or plug in).
              Until I see OPEC die a horrible death burning in [torment] will be the day I give up my cng vehicles. I remember 1974 well, the last year of my trucking.
              Last edited by CNGLO; 02-07-2014, 12:26 PM. Reason: TOS language violation

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              • #22
                Re: Cng vs gasoline

                Originally posted by Mingus108 View Post
                Until I see OPEC die a horrible death burning in [torment] will be the day I give up my cng vehicles. I remember 1974 well, the last year of my trucking.
                well said mingus. let opec drink their oil and pound sand I love my cng vehicles if the cost was the same I would burn cng just so opec could go [burn in torment]. one billion a day we send to opec to buy guns and ammo to shoot at us with one day.keep it here and use it to send welfare recipients to the oil patch here to drill for more gas. and if we ship it out of the country some one said btu for btu dont think that will work but how about btu price for bbl of oil = btu of gas the price would be the same per btu let opec charge whatever they want but they get to pay the same per btu for gas
                Last edited by CNGLO; 02-07-2014, 12:31 PM. Reason: TOS language violation

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                • #23
                  Re: Cng vs gasoline

                  Originally posted by cowboy View Post
                  well said mingus. let opec drink their oil and pound sand I love my cng vehicles if the cost was the same I would burn cng just so opec could go [burn in torment]. one billion a day we send to opec to buy guns and ammo to shoot at us with one day.keep it here and use it to send welfare recipients to the oil patch here to drill for more gas. and if we ship it out of the country some one said btu for btu dont think that will work but how about btu price for bbl of oil = btu of gas the price would be the same per btu let opec charge whatever they want but they get to pay the same per btu for gas
                  I am with you on that, however my only concern here is how to differentiate between OPEC oil and this produced in US. As of right now 75% of US petroleum consumption is from domestic sources http://www.americanprogress.org/issu...e-oil-at-home/. I am also with you use as little as you can, no need to drive truck if there is no cargo, no need for big car if small and efficient will do the job.
                  OilExportfigures-1.jpg
                  Last edited by CNGLO; 02-07-2014, 12:31 PM. Reason: TOS language violation in quoted text

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                  • #24
                    Re: Cng vs gasoline

                    Let's keep the language clean, boys. With a little imagination you can get your point across without the foul terms.
                    _____________________________________
                    '12 Blue Mist Metallic Civic Natural Gas; '03 Galapagos Green Civic GX; '07 Alabaster White Civic GX

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                    • #25
                      Re: Cng vs gasoline

                      Don't feel bad Cowboy, I was reprimanded by the 31/2 year old grand daughter when I used the word stupid. She had been taught in pre-school that it was a bad word. Glad I'm on my way out

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                      • #26
                        Re: Cng vs gasoline

                        Now look I voted for Romney, and I drink milk when I lived in Provo. But In Nevada every time I turned around I liked to been run over by Later Day Saints.
                        But it is your board, OK?
                        Last edited by Mingus108; 02-08-2014, 05:33 AM.

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                        • #27
                          Re: Cng vs gasoline

                          Originally posted by cowboy View Post
                          I was in Knoxville today and saw gasoline for 2.99 with gasoline getting so cheap why would anyone want to spend 10 or 20 thousand to ride on fuel that is a dollar cheaper. It makes me wonder if it is done by the oil giants to slow the use of natural gas. It seems to me that whenever cng seems to be picking up steam the price of gasoline falls. of coarse I know that it is just a trick and the price will go up again. but the site seems real slow .I just wonder if the low gasoline prices are the cause.
                          The problem is even worse than that. Being a noob, I was wondering why CNG was not more widely adopted? The longer I'm on the forum, the more I read, the more obvious it is as to why CNG probably won't take off beyond some niche markets. The economics just aren't there for your average driver.

                          In my own personal case, I live within a few miles of a couple of CNG stations. There are several in the metro area. And as of today, I would save about a dollar a gallon equivalent to drive a CNG vehicle. In and of itself, not bad. But to get into a low dollar cost vehicle to try it out, I would have to buy a vehicle with expired or close to expired cylinder with probably at least 100,000 miles on it. Assuming on the low end that it would cost $3000.00 to replace that cylinder, and assuming say 25 mpg (what I get with my current subcompact) I would have to drive 75,000 miles before I were to break even. But it's even worse than that. Given that I would have to obtain at least 2 inspections that I wouldn't otherwise purchase at let's say $200 a pop, that puts out the breakeven point to 85,000 miles. On a car that would have at least 100,000 miles on its odometer already. But its even worse than that. As its a CNG vehicle, its not like I can drop it off at my local garage and get it fixed with parts that are commonly available at NAPA. I've noticed the problems that folks have just getting injectors.

                          But we can also run this analysis with a new car as well. Assuming that I were to pay an extra $5000 for a new CNG vehicle that gets 25 mpg, that means a CNG breakeven point at 125,000 miles plus added cost of at least $600 for inspections, or 140,000 miles for breakeven. Assuming the car lasts to that point.

                          Its unfortunate, but it looks to me that from an economic perspective, its far smarter to drive a gasoline powered subcompact as long as it lasts rather than get into CNG. Which is the same problem that hybrids face. Exceptions would of course be vehicles that are heavy fuel users. Or that are driven extensively, or both.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Cng vs gasoline

                            In So. Ca. the biggest selling point has always been access to the carpool lane, cheap fuel has always been a bonus. About 12 years ago when we had the "energy crisis" I had a lot of people [complaining] at me because CNG was more than gasoline but none of them wanted to go back loose access to the car pool lane. When The cost of natural gas dropped & gasoline rose no of my customers said boo. As we all know when it comes to Gasoline, every thing that goes down will go back up......even higher.
                            Last edited by CNGLO; 12-11-2014, 01:33 PM. Reason: TOS language violation

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                            • #29
                              Re: Cng vs gasoline

                              In SF Bay Area, access to car pool lane is main motivating factor for owning CNG car. It's the reason I have a GX.

                              Price recently dropped to $2.44 from $2.54.
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                              • #30
                                Re: Cng vs gasoline

                                Originally posted by cowboy View Post
                                one billion a day we send to opec to buy guns and ammo to shoot at us with one day.keep it here and use it to send welfare recipients to the oil patch here to drill for more gas.
                                Instead of more oil, it makes sense to consider the biomethane from sewage treatment plants and sanitary landfills. Also, instead of subsidizing corn ethanol, it would make more sense to install biodigesters in farms to process the livestock manure and agricultural residues into bio-gas. I have been a dieselhead for a long time, but regarding spark-ignition engines I see bio-gas/bio-CNG as the best option because it doesn't rely on fossil reserves and doesn't compete with food production.

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