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How do I avoid drilling my chassis (frame?) to secure and plumb pipework

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  • How do I avoid drilling my chassis (frame?) to secure and plumb pipework


    I've an old Land-rover, I don't suppose you have too many stateside but the problem is the same.

    Had a ground-up rebuild and I had the chassis galvanised. I don't want to compromise the galving, and cable-ties will not only look a mess but are hardly the way to go. So, how would some of you suggest I fix or strap the 'P' clips or the pipe to my chassis (frame?), without wrecking the integrity of the zinc? This vehicle has a separate chassis, primitive thing and very 'agricultural' but the problem must exist when doing installs to late cars. Although the cynic in me would think, you just drill, simply because by the time it's a problem the car's in the crusher anyway - all your drilling did was help it on its way.

    Only, this vehicle has been around all my life, and if I have anything to do with it, will be around a helluva' lot longer..
    Last edited by BritCNGUser; 08-08-2017, 01:45 PM.

  • #2
    Believe it or not , over here in the Colonies , Land Rovers are quite the item for collectors , the few that still exist. Never seen one on CNG, but no reason not to do it. I'd love to watch the shop dipping that frame in a hot dip galvi tank.


    • #3
      OK, I know that at bonkers prices, LRC ( push a fair few Stateside. I gathered these sit in the classic-car market quite well. Mine is running CNG now (of a fashion). It's been running LPG for the last 16 odd years (see the large saddle tanks just about visible underneath in the pic). I did a quick barn-yard feasibility / lash-up install, with my cylinders still sitting on a wheelbarrow, (yes i know), then worked with it running off my bowser. It worked well enough. I now want to pull the LPG off, (although I could leave the LPG on for a Tri-fueler?) then do a proper install. Hence my question.

      BTW: That bath for galving was mahoosive.
      Last edited by BritCNGUser; 08-09-2017, 03:08 AM.


      • #4
        is it a tube frame? if it is you could slide your hp tubing through a piece of cheap pvc air hose so it cant rub. than slide it through the frame. or my pretty idea would be to weld small bolts ie 1/4 or 6mm head to head so that the threads stick out when the big bolt is where it belongs to larger bolts that will be needed to hold other things on ie cross members spring hangers and other things that bolt through the frame. than just use any type of clamp and lock washer and than a nut you like


        • #5
          I think I've the gist of what you're saying. Tube frame but to get into it, I'd have to drill. You other way would work I think, but your cheap PVC air hosing as a sheath gives me an idea. This with perhaps 'stainless' strapping , our utilitiies use it to strap shut their 'Cable Termination cabinets', (also like they use on wooden shipping crates) around the lot, such that it can't vibrate and rub. Find some in Balck, and it would be quick and look tidy too without being too much of a mud-trap.
          Last edited by BritCNGUser; 08-14-2017, 11:00 AM.


          • #6
            I have done the pvc air trick and got it in and out of the frame through existing holes ie shipping tie down holes and other unused holes it is a pain in the back side but can be done with lashing wire and a few coat hangers I have found that getting a piece of the lashing wire through first than pulling on the lashing wire and having your friend push gently on the tubing works well also you dont want a good rubber air hose you need a piece of the cheapest pvc 3/8 is what I use as it is slick inside and out and excellent wear resistance I did one that way with bulkhead fittings in the factory tie down holes they were slots so had to have washers on both side. than parker par-flex to the hp regulator and the solenoid valve on the tank looked real slick but did give new meaning to pain in the back side


            • #7
              I'll have a looksee, somewhere in the chassis sectiion there may be a way in and out, and if there is, for even part of it, that would be truly the way to do it. Not due to do the job for a few weeks at least so will have plenty of time to plot this out. Thanks


              • #8
                I never recommend Parflex for vehicle use. Its fine as a dispenser hose but the unfortunate reality is that it can melt in a fire before the PRDs give way. This was the situation with a taxi in Phoenix back about 10 years ago when the car burned to the ground. Better to use braided stainless flex lines.


                • #9
                  Just been doing some digging - UK regs say: Pipe runs must be no closer than 300mm from any part of the exhaust system and must be visible along their full run... Kinda makes sense, would think Yank specsmuch the same and agreed, Parkaflex will be a no, no.

                  LPG is at 25Bar, but with CNG I can't see to treat it as any less!
                  Last edited by BritCNGUser; 08-16-2017, 01:14 PM.


                  • #10
                    john just think with the prds dumping under the car what difference would it make? most do. the prd blows and discharges under the car it burns up if a line burns in two under the car it dumps under the car the car burns up till it is mandated that all cng prds blow up a stack at least 6 inchs above the highest point of said car or truck I think you point is moot. some big trucks I have seen dump too low to make me happy. I think that a dump valve plumbed into the same stack should be mandated so the gas can be dumped much sooner than waiting for the prds have it mounted through the fender like the battery disconnect switch on race cars this way the owner or the fire department can dump all the gas instead of waiting for the pressure and temp to rise the thing is not to save the car but to get rid of the gas as fast as possible. this is just my humble opinion and that my friends and 2 bucks will get you a cup of coffee unless you go to star bucks than it may be5 or 10 LOL hose =prd?


                    • #11
                      Thanks gents for yoru help. I'm curious, in American Automotive [English], almost everything is different. Eg: In English what you would refer to as a 'frame' is always a 'chassis' yet sometimes I'll hear Americans refer to cars with a chassis. In American, when does a car have a chassis over a frame?


                      • #12
                        I dont know brit i thinks that it is used interchangeably but dont know for sure


                        • #13
                          Fair enough, not sure why, but [Automotive/ Engineering] American has you blokes speaking a different language. We have hoods you don't wear, fenders with nothing to do with Mr Hendrix, and trunks that don't come with elephants.

                          You have to smile. Long as it works...


                          • #14
                            I am curious how adequate the Land Rover's power is running on CNG. I converted my 1948 Willys Jeep to Propane 10 years ago and there was some power loss but not unmanageable. I then converted it to CNG and the lack of power took all the fun out of driving it. This is a 134 cu in flathead engine with 6:1 compression and around 60 hp running on gasoline.
                            I ended up putting a Saab turbo on it I picked up at the wrecking yard and recovered some of the power but CNG doesn't seem to work that well as a retrofit for old technology small displacement "agricultural" engines designed to run on gasoline. I would have done better recovering the power if I knew how to find a turbo with a compressor ratio better suited to the old flathead willys particular characteristics.
                            I am using an impco ca100 carb and pj regulator. I first tried a blow through carburetor arrangement but couldn't get it to run right so I changed it to a draw through carb/turbo and it works fairly well.
                            The entire conversion was a fun project and interesting conversation piece but pretty unsatisfactory in terms of performance.



                            • #15
                              Your comments made me smile.

                              I'm pretty sure that had I not upped the CR and put in a hot cam and all the other stuff, I'd have seen much the same as you! My LR is the piece of junk I love. Its very agricutural in stock trim, 7.5CR, 67bhp (on a good day). I suspect it'll be slower than your Jeep. It's certainly heavier.

                              I too used to run LPG. I now run 10.5 and CNG. Even so it's not fast. But if it was 'fast' I wanted, reckon I'm a fool - I'm starting in the wrong place.

                              Steering and brakes means no matter how much power I gain or lose 65mph is really all you'd ever want. Dangerous with more. I now have a disc bake conversion fitted up front, but it's still not truly safe at much over 50-55mph. And I'm probably deluding myself with these numbers, but I have about 110bhp with petrol, probably less, and still less when I run CNG, (LPG was better) but it goes up the hills and keeps up with modern traffic, just.

                              I don't know why I have it. It doesn't stop, it doesn't handle. It's noisy. It makes a mess. It's a pile of poo actaully, and like a toddler it's a nuisance. I ever complain, but should you ever suggest taking it from me....

                              "134 cu in flathead engine with 6:1 compression and around 60 hp running on gasoline." I smile, am I surprised CNG killed it? Like mine, it's a tractor. I'm sure CNG took easily 15bhp off. That 6:1 robbed it of the little torque it had to begin with. Like mine, it's a nail.

                              "pretty unsatisfactory in terms of performance."

                              Yeah right. A Jeep could look a bit silly on English roads, yet I bet it has a charm and character no current vehicle will ever possess. I want one. I'd love it.

                              Found this only the other day:

                              Last edited by BritCNGUser; 10-07-2017, 06:38 PM.