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What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it run?

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  • What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it run?

    Just wondering if it would, or is a different fill nossle and tank needed?

  • nttrainer
    replied
    Originally posted by jenki_putnik View Post
    Re: What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it

    Hydrogen/Natural Gas (HCNG) Fuel Blends

    Natural gas can be blended with hydrogen to make HCNG. Vehicles fueled with hydrogen/natural gas blends (HCNG) are an initial step toward the hydrogen-based transportation of the future. HCNG vehicles offer the potential for immediate emissions benefits, such as a reduction in nitrogen oxides (NOx) emissions. At the same time, they can pave the way for a transition to fuel cell vehicles by building early demand for hydrogen infrastructure.

    The U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) supports light- and heavy-duty HCNG projects. DOE's Advanced Vehicle Testing Activity (AVTA) teamed with industry partners to construct and operate a hydrogen and compressed natural gas (CNG) generation and fueling facility in Phoenix, Arizona. The facility provides pure hydrogen, pure CNG, or HCNG blends to light-duty test vehicles that have been independently modified to operate on these fuels. For more information, visit AVTA's Hydrogen Blended Fuel Vehicles project.

    DOE's Natural Gas Vehicle Technology Forum supported a project to develop heavy-duty HCNG engines and transit buses. The HCNG (20% hydrogen, 80% CNG) engines demonstrated lower emissions, including a 50% reduction in NOx, than similar engines fueled with CNG alone with no significant change in fuel efficiency. Chassis dynamometer emission testing confirmed the substantial NOx reduction due to HCNG when the engines were integrated into transit buses. For more information on the project, see the following document:

    Development and Demonstration of Hydrogen and Compressed Natural Gas (H/CNG) Blend Transit Buses

    http://www.afdc.energy.gov/afdc/fuel...as_blends.html

    The Ford F150 used in these tests was purchased by CNG Utah about the same time this was posted. The 4 tanks in the truck were replaced with one 18gge tank from a Chevy Silverado. The truck is supercharged and is a blast to drive on CNG. Your chance to own a piece of history
    http://cngutah.com/forsale/276/index.php

    Leave a comment:


  • BritCNGUser
    replied
    Re: What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it

    fwiw: At a former job, we found that at 20,000psi methane also can penetrate steel vessels...
    Scary! This had not occurred to me, but I suppose it must folllow. At an atomic level this is true at far lwoer pressures, only the effect is so small as to be forgetable.

    Leave a comment:


  • rtry9a
    replied
    Re: What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it

    Originally posted by aviator1912
    I worked with hydrogen and deuterium (heavy hydrogen) systems in the military and leaks were always an issue due to the small molecules. We could leak check the system with helium and still get leaks when we put in the hydrogen. So your vehicle may leak H2 even though it does not leak CNG.

    It also has explosion limits of 2-75% as opposed to methane which is 5-15%. We had one (unintentional) open air ignition of 2 lb of hydrogen that they heard 15 miles away. So I recommend you be happy with C4H which is mostly hydrogen anyway.
    fwiw: At a former job, we found that at 20,000psi methane also can penetrate steel vessels...

    Leave a comment:


  • jenki_putnik
    replied
    Re: What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it

    Hydrogen/Natural Gas (HCNG) Fuel Blends

    Natural gas can be blended with hydrogen to make HCNG. Vehicles fueled with hydrogen/natural gas blends (HCNG) are an initial step toward the hydrogen-based transportation of the future. HCNG vehicles offer the potential for immediate emissions benefits, such as a reduction in nitrogen oxides (NOx) emissions. At the same time, they can pave the way for a transition to fuel cell vehicles by building early demand for hydrogen infrastructure.

    The U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) supports light- and heavy-duty HCNG projects. DOE's Advanced Vehicle Testing Activity (AVTA) teamed with industry partners to construct and operate a hydrogen and compressed natural gas (CNG) generation and fueling facility in Phoenix, Arizona. The facility provides pure hydrogen, pure CNG, or HCNG blends to light-duty test vehicles that have been independently modified to operate on these fuels. For more information, visit AVTA's Hydrogen Blended Fuel Vehicles project.

    DOE's Natural Gas Vehicle Technology Forum supported a project to develop heavy-duty HCNG engines and transit buses. The HCNG (20% hydrogen, 80% CNG) engines demonstrated lower emissions, including a 50% reduction in NOx, than similar engines fueled with CNG alone with no significant change in fuel efficiency. Chassis dynamometer emission testing confirmed the substantial NOx reduction due to HCNG when the engines were integrated into transit buses. For more information on the project, see the following document:

    Development and Demonstration of Hydrogen and Compressed Natural Gas (H/CNG) Blend Transit Buses

    http://www.afdc.energy.gov/afdc/fuel...as_blends.html
    Attached Files

    Leave a comment:


  • onefasteg
    replied
    Re: What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it

    Sweet, thanks for the info.

    Leave a comment:


  • larrycng
    replied
    Re: What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it

    If you put about 20% hydrogen in the tank along with 80% CNG you would have hythane (staying below 3600 psi) You would run cleaner with a little loss of power. You might also get a check engine light for fuel trim exceeding it positive limit since the injectors would have to stay open longer to get enough fuel.

    Larrycng

    P.S. Hythane as been sold pre-mixed at the pump
    Last edited by larrycng; 03-18-2011, 08:17 PM. Reason: forgot something

    Leave a comment:


  • scott
    replied
    Re: What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it

    Right you are. Same basic shape, but different nozzle size. I'm filling at 5,000 lb (the only choice at my station). I think BMW is at 10,000.

    Leave a comment:


  • Lakewood90712
    replied
    Re: What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it

    For one thing , your wallet will be a lot thinner. Try $5.00 per GGE for compressed H2.

    Leave a comment:


  • Highmarker
    replied
    Re: What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it

    It is a different fueling nozzle and tank altogether. Hydrogen is compressed to 5,000 psi or even 10,000 psi. On your CNG tank is says "CNG ONLY".

    Leave a comment:


  • Amfuel
    replied
    Re: What would happen if you filled your Civic GX with Compressed Hydrogen, would it

    Yep, different in everything. Run? No. H2 burns 4x faster than CH4 so without flashback arresters there would be a big boom.

    Leave a comment:

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