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Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

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  • #46
    Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

    A little late for the original poster, but this is why I think it pays to buy the Hondacare extended warranty. The extended warranties are priced the same for the GXs as gasoline Civics, which makes it a much better deal given the much more expensive potential costs of GX repairs.

    The dealers have a huge markup on these plans, but there are dealers on the internet selling them at a huge discount. I paid $945 for a 120k/96 month warranty with $0 deductible.

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    • #47
      Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

      Originally posted by danaman View Post
      Those of you who have a similar problem please let me know because the issue is currently being investigated by the defective parts division of the DOT. Let me know or you can contact them directly at (888) 327-4236 , TTY: (800) 424-9153.
      I called this number and they said there was no such investigation (at least not one that this particular government could find). My 2008 Civic GX (79,650 miles and a 120,000 mile Honda Care Extended Service Contract) had the fuel tank failure described in this thread and the Honda dealer in Wichita KS gave me a quote for $8,200.00, but calmly mentioned that this included tax but my Honda Care extended service contract rep had declined to pay for it because it was "an excluded repair". THEN, he acted surprised when I told them not to touch the vehicle because I would be taking it back to Tulsa OK for the needed repairs.

      When I called Honda Care to veify the denial of the repair, sure enough, they said that it was an excluded repair, when I ask why the rep just said "The part is not in the computer". I just casually mentioned that perhaps no part was in the computer until someone put it in there and if he could just kindly put it in the computer all would be well. He told me to hold and immediately transferred me out to Honda Customer Service.

      Honda Customer Service said that they had nothing to do with Honda Care (odd since Honda name and logo are all over the cover of the contract) but would assign a specialist to walk me through the entire repair experience. (This specialist called me back 2 days later and told me she was a transmission specialist and if my problem was not a transmission that she could not help me)

      I called the Clark Howard show and ask that a "rip off alert" be issued for the Honda Care Extended warranty. I called the dealer in Tulsa where I had purchased the car and the salesman referred me to call Tom at Tulsa Gas Technology. Tom told me that the repair would run around $400 or so, but they would not be replacing the tank, just the valve that had failed - this was the first sensible thing that I had heard concerning this repair - After all, what kind of idiot designs a vehicle that cost more to repair a $200 valve that replace the engine?

      In the meantime, for some reason Honda Care suddenly did a 180 and decided they WOULD pay for the repair. I am not sure if the 180 was the result of someone there finally reading the agreement, the fact that the Tulsa dealer where I bought the car and contract calling to request the specefic reason for denial, the Clark Howard show checking in with them, or maybe something I am unaware of. I can only say that the most frightening part of the entire ordeal is that most people that have one of these vehicle failures do not have the benefit of a dealer and salesman that is aware of the options that exist outside the "Honda fish bowl" for this $8,000+ repair. I personally credit Tulsa Gas Technology for their development of the affordable repair and Joe Marina Honda for knowing how to advise me in accomplishing this repair without the necessity for me to expend $8,000 out of my own pocket.

      This entire ordeal only took one day from the denial of coverage to full approval of the repair, and now 10 days later, my vehicle is at Joe Marina Honda waiting to be fueled and tested.

      I believe I will be having this $400 repair done as soon as my vehicles 120,000 service contract expires rather than waiting for this poorly engineered system to fail 220 miles from home again.

      Other than this one little pathetic example of poor engineering this has been a great car, I will say that I have enjoyed driving my Honda Civic GX and it has never given hint of any other kind of trouble.

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      • #48
        Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

        Interesting that Tulsa Gas Technology offered a $400 repair solution. My local independent repair source believes that the the Honda tank uses a proprietary Honda threaded fitting. There is a more common valve which is nearly identical that runs $400 but as far as I am aware, Honda will not sell just the valve due to certification/safety issues. My local shop will do my next repair if it ever comes up by gutting the Honda solenoid and installing an in-line valve which can be more easily serviced. (Currently at 60K+ miles on my '09 with 15K+ on my latest tank/solenoid combo)
        '11 Fusion Bi Fuel & FMQ2-36 VRA
        (Former owner '09 Civic GX)

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        • #49
          Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

          Why 8000$ if the tank cost 4500-5000$?

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          • #50
            Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

            LABOR - The rear interior of the car has to be totally dis-assembled to get the tank out through the rear driver side door. While they are at it, they aslo change the HP and LP filters at the same time. Takes my local dealer a day to vent the full tank and to dis-assemble. Day two to install & re-assemble and fill overnight (they use Phil), returning the car on day three if all checks out OK. Not to mention, it may take up to a week to get the tank shipped in unless you live in CA.
            '11 Fusion Bi Fuel & FMQ2-36 VRA
            (Former owner '09 Civic GX)

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            • #51
              Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

              Originally posted by raskell View Post
              Interesting that Tulsa Gas Technology offered a $400 repair solution. My local independent repair source believes that the the Honda tank uses a proprietary Honda threaded fitting. There is a more common valve which is nearly identical that runs $400 but as far as I am aware, Honda will not sell just the valve due to certification/safety issues. My local shop will do my next repair if it ever comes up by gutting the Honda solenoid and installing an in-line valve which can be more easily serviced. (Currently at 60K+ miles on my '09 with 15K+ on my latest tank/solenoid combo)
              I believe they disable the valve in a way that causes it stays open and add a new valve in the line somewhere along the line in a way similar to the way a system is set up on a conversion. This "in tank" valve is something that is used by the manufacturers but something different is used for the conversions - probably so it won't cost $8,000 to repair when the valve fails. Only a manufacturer could think something like that is a good idea whereas a conversion shop has to deal with you face to face.

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              • #52
                Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

                http://www.gficontrolsystems.com/pdf/GFI%20PDFs.pdf


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                • #53
                  Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

                  Does anyone know the thread spec on the Honda tanks? Is it 2.00-12UNC?

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

                    My local CNG retrofit shop tech tells me that the solenoid valve pictured is identical to the Honda valve except for the threads. He states that Honda uses their own thread design which makes the commercially avalable one of no use to us GX owners. The Honda threaded valve has not been available for purchase, locking us into the complete tank replacement.
                    '11 Fusion Bi Fuel & FMQ2-36 VRA
                    (Former owner '09 Civic GX)

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                    • #55
                      Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

                      Make adaptor or put two custom pipes.

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                      • #56
                        Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

                        To all the folks that have had this issue - was there any know problems prior to it flat out not starting? Like intermittent hard starting?
                        Thanks!

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

                          @taigacarol

                          I replied to your other thread. No pre-warning when the solenoid fails. This is an all or nothing proposition and can not be reset by the owner. When it errors out, the car must be towed into the delaer to be reset. If your fuel gage has not dropped to Empty and Flashing, you haven't had a solenoid failure.
                          '11 Fusion Bi Fuel & FMQ2-36 VRA
                          (Former owner '09 Civic GX)

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                          • #58
                            Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

                            Originally posted by raskell View Post
                            My local CNG retrofit shop tech tells me that the solenoid valve pictured is identical to the Honda valve except for the threads. He states that Honda uses their own thread design which makes the commercially avalable one of no use to us GX owners. The Honda threaded valve has not been available for purchase, locking us into the complete tank replacement.
                            Raskell, so with this statement this, is the local shop installing an in-line valve still an option when the solenoid goes bad? Is a bad solenoid still use able which the in-line modification? I'd like to purchase a GX, but my main concern is this very problem.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

                              Yes, if you local shop mechanic is capable of doing conversions then they should be able to come up with an in-line retrofit. I have no first hand knowledge of anyone doing this but in theory it is possible and my local mechanic says he'd be willing to have a go at it if it comes down to that.

                              The other possibility is to remove the failed valve and rebuild it with internal parts from GFI. Since Honda uses a proprietary valve body, specifically the tank mating threads, it is likely that the rest of the moving parts are the stock GFI design.

                              I hope to have a more affirmative response figured out within the next month or so. Keep checking back at the forum for more updates.
                              '11 Fusion Bi Fuel & FMQ2-36 VRA
                              (Former owner '09 Civic GX)

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Re: Civic GX won't start; $7000 repair

                                Originally posted by SkyG View Post
                                Raskell, so with this statement this, is the local shop installing an in-line valve still an option when the solenoid goes bad? Is a bad solenoid still use able which the in-line modification? I'd like to purchase a GX, but my main concern is this very problem.
                                I think you would be good to go in California if you are going to use the public re-fueling. From what I am able to piece together, there may be more issues or occurrences with home re-fuelers than with 'fast' fillers. Perhaps this would make a good topic for a new thread?
                                '11 Fusion Bi Fuel & FMQ2-36 VRA
                                (Former owner '09 Civic GX)

                                Comment

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