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  • Low pressure fuel filter help

    Decided to do high, low and oil change for my 2015 Honda Civic GX. Got in trouble on the low pressure filter install and need help.

    During removal of the LP Fuel filter canister came off smoothly. Filter and inner housing are clean. Had to move the exhaust pipe to make more room to get to the filter.

    After trying install last night, I left the filter housing in freezer over night without o-ring hoping it would reduce the diameter. Went to install and this morning and the o-ring keeps getting pushed out. Removed the o-ring canister screws in, threads are good. O-ring will not stay seated. Tried petroleum grease, still pops out. Cleaned everything, still pops out.

    I am going to leave the canister with o-ring on in the freezer for a couple hours and try again this afternoon. If it repeats again and o-ring pops out, will go back to Honda for another o-ring (I know it will involve buying another filter).

    How did you get the canister back on?

    Desperate

  • #2
    Re: Low pressure fuel filter help

    Originally posted by Greg View Post
    Decided to do high, low and oil change for my 2015 Honda Civic GX. Got in trouble on the low pressure filter install and need help.

    During removal of the LP Fuel filter canister came off smoothly. Filter and inner housing are clean. Had to move the exhaust pipe to make more room to get to the filter.

    After trying install last night, I left the filter housing in freezer over night without o-ring hoping it would reduce the diameter. Went to install and this morning and the o-ring keeps getting pushed out. Removed the o-ring canister screws in, threads are good. O-ring will not stay seated. Tried petroleum grease, still pops out. Cleaned everything, still pops out.

    I am going to leave the canister with o-ring on in the freezer for a couple hours and try again this afternoon. If it repeats again and o-ring pops out, will go back to Honda for another o-ring (I know it will involve buying another filter).

    How did you get the canister back on?

    Desperate
    Perseverance, Daniel-san.
    It is a pain in the rear, and may take multiple freeze cycles, but it will squeeze in there.

    In my opinion the poorest filter design in the auto industry...

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Low pressure fuel filter help

      Thanks jsorger
      Took a bit of patience, a new oring (important part) and silicone grease and all went back together.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Low pressure fuel filter help

        Originally posted by Greg View Post
        Thanks jsorger
        Took a bit of patience, a new oring (important part) and silicone grease and all went back together.

        Do you have an oring part number that you can share?

        Thanks!

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        • #5
          I just changed mine 7 days ago on a 2012. I read several tutorials on here and watched a few videos and had done my 2001 multiple times so I thought it would go smoothly and started work around 10pm with plans to check high pressure, change low pressure and do an oil change. One post said to tape a socket on to allow you to thread on easier by hand and claimed it was a 15 sec install that way.

          Away I went; Checked high pressure, drained oil, removed low pressure, 20 minutes on the clock, all going well. Went to reinstall low pressure... it took about 30 seconds... the final attempt that is, the previous 1000 attempts took over 4 hours. Didn't get to bed until 4am that night. Was by far the hardest piece of anything I have installed on anything and I have done a lot of wrenching.

          I tried the freeze technique, the socket, tag teaming from above and below with my brother, socket extensions and every combination of them all. My brother was the one to make the winning attempt and hard to say why it worked but what worked was; LOTS of silicone grease, socket taped to filter housing from below with the exhaust pipe disconnected at the manifold for access. The final attempt was at 70 degrees, freezing didn't help us but might have been my bad luck. We indexed the filter to identify exactly the orientation the thread started to engage without the oring on and used that to focus on where to start the push/rotate that got it to engage.If there were just one or two more threads on the housing it would be so much easier, I agree the engineering leaved room for improvement.

          There was no noticeable oil or fluid in the high housing and the low was spotless as well. I fuel at CE 90% of the time. The last successful attempt was so easy it is a tease to DIY it again at the next interval. I'm not goign to think about it until then and from my experience it is as ahrd as most of teh posters have made it seem.

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          • #6
            to add: I have heard petroleum grease is not recommended on this oring, silicon only.

            Also, freezing canister without oring does not make sense to me. Without the oring it threads on great, the issue as far as I can tell is the oring has to be compressed into the cavity that is is designed to live in at the same time or slightly before the threads engage, the challenge was getting the oring to pop into place and get positive pressure on the housing as you spin it and get the threads to engage. Freezing the oring makes sense to me so it will shrink and get out of the way a little better but what do I know, I spent 5 hours with 2 people doing a 15 second task!

            I like the idea of counter rotating to seat the oring.

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            • #7
              Couple thoughts about freezing the filter housing and freezing the oring, I do not believe it helps and freezing the oring might not help either.

              Standard home refrigerator is set at 40 c and 0 c for the freezer.
              Steel alloy has a shrinkage of appro. 2.0 thousandths at approx. -196 c (see http://www.liquidnitrogenservices.com.au/shrinkfit.htm)
              Let's assume your refrigerator is 30 feet from your car.
              You see where this is going.
              If I where to freeze the filter housing 0c, grab it with glove, rush to the car, crawl under and start the install. The shrinkage would be so small it wouldn't matter.

              Regarding the rubber oring. On a molecular level rubber works because the molecules are bunched up and when pulled unwind and align into chains. Freezing inhibits this ability (the opposite happen when you heat rubber (so why does a rubber band shrink when you heat it?)). Freezing inhibits the stretchiness of the rubber and makes it brittle. This could damage the oring.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Greg View Post
                Couple thoughts about freezing the filter housing and freezing the oring, I do not believe it helps and freezing the oring might not help either.

                Standard home refrigerator is set at 40 c and 0 c for the freezer.
                Steel alloy has a shrinkage of appro. 2.0 thousandths at approx. -196 c (see http://www.liquidnitrogenservices.com.au/shrinkfit.htm)
                Let's assume your refrigerator is 30 feet from your car.
                You see where this is going.
                If I where to freeze the filter housing 0c, grab it with glove, rush to the car, crawl under and start the install. The shrinkage would be so small it wouldn't matter.

                Regarding the rubber oring. On a molecular level rubber works because the molecules are bunched up and when pulled unwind and align into chains. Freezing inhibits this ability (the opposite happen when you heat rubber (so why does a rubber band shrink when you heat it?)). Freezing inhibits the stretchiness of the rubber and makes it brittle. This could damage the oring.
                Back in 2008 or 2009, I tried several times over the space of many hours to get the low pressure filter into place. Once I thought about it for a while and came upon the idea to freeze the canister and o-ring together, I was able to get the o-ring to pop into place with little trouble. I've since changed a couple more times, each time freezing them together. It works like a charm. All theoretical calculations cannot beat the real world experience of trying it out and finding that the method works. I understand that Honda changed its shop instructions to have their dealer technicians freeze them together when changing the filter.
                _____________________________________
                '12 Blue Mist Metallic Civic Natural Gas; '03 Galapagos Green Civic GX; '07 Alabaster White Civic GX

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                • #9
                  My independent Acura/Honda shop in San Jose uses that technique successfully. They have at least one employee that owns a GX and of course many customers.
                  Sold GX

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                  • #10
                    Can someone please recommend the brand of silicone grease they used and where they purchased it at? I purchased Sil-Glyde from Napa (Part # 765-1351) and I wanted to make sure it is ok to use on the O Ring. I'm also having a heck of time getting the LP canister on the housing.

                    Lastly, do you recommend to put the silicone grease on the o ring while its on the housing in the freezer or coat the o ring right before you try to install the LP canister in the housing?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I used to use Molycoat # 55 , I have seen at least one ( Factory Trained) Tech at a Honda dealer using common wheel bearing grease for this. Not sure if it was ignorance, not having silicone grease available, or could be his own trick using a tacky grease to hold the o-ring in place.

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                      • #12
                        I have used Sil-Glyde twice now.

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                        • #13
                          Thanks for the responses Lakewwod90712 and jsorger. I'll use the Sil-Glyde I purchased.

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                          • #14
                            I strongly suggest putting grip tape on the low pressure fuel filter canister. Any of the fancy custom (overpriced) replacement canisters should come with knurling or grip tape.

                            3M Safety Walk anti-slip tape (meant for stairs etc) worked for me. 7635NA

                            I had a lot of trouble with the low pressure fuel filter replacement about a year ago when I first tried it. The canister was already bent from previous removals/installations and I had tried the following:

                            - Using the special Honda grease
                            - Marking the beginning of the threads on the canister and housing
                            - Freezing the canister and O-ring

                            I was unsuccessful and after hours of attempts and having the car parked for a week, my uncle put grip tape on the canister. This was the last little bit of help that I needed to get the threads started without popping the O-ring out of position.

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                            • #15
                              ive done the low pressure filter twice already and have done it each time in my garage using small ramps and w/out leaving the canister in the freezer, which helps but is not a requirement.

                              1st time was hell...did the freezer method and wasnt able to take advantage of it as the canister laid out in ambient temp so long from failed attempts to get it back in. it took me probably over an hour to get it in.

                              2nd attempt took about 20min once i finally got to the actual installation remembering what worked the first time.

                              what i found in both attempts that helped greatly is getting the right hand position and leverage on the canister while you push forward with your ratchet. this is key as contorting your body if youre not in the correct orientation to apply enough force will leave you w/ a spinning canister that doesnt grab ever.

                              each time i was laying parallel w/ the length of the car with my head positioned at the firewall and feet at the front of the car beyond the bumper. this allows you to get your hand directly below the filter. i also used a straight extension about 8" on a 3/8" rachet so i could apply enough force while im torquing the canister down. i used my free hand to guide the canister as well.
                              on the 2nd install, i tore a brand new o ring so be careful. it helps to leave a dab of silicon on the oring so it doesnt snag anything while you're tightening things up.



                              98 civic gx - the hov lane runner
                              97 supercharged mustang - 440rwhp gas hog
                              02 pathfinder

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